[00:00:00] The Swell Season Podcast is recorded by the New Stand Studio at Rockefeller Center in the heart of Manhattan and is distributed by the Swell Season Surf Radio Network.

[00:00:38] Scarlett 2i2 USB & NexiGo N930E FHD Webcam: hello and welcome to the swell season surf podcast. I'm your host Tyler Brewer. Nick Hounsfield was [00:01:00] introduced to surfing by his father, Brian in the mid 1970s on his regular visits to Cornwall in the United Kingdom. He has been an avid surfer ever since. Nick became an osteopath by trade and found it as successful family business with his wife, but as time wore on and when Nick's father passed away in the late two thousands, He started to think about the world a little differently. He began to think about open spaces in nature. And the healing aspects of engaging and being in nature. He started to realize that a lot of people's poor health was due to a number of things, not exercising, not eating well, lack of connection to others, and a lack of connection to nature. And he said about trying to pull all these different factors together and look at how he could solve some of these issues through one holistic vision. By [00:02:00] chance.

[00:02:00] This was around the same time that wave garden released the video of their first technology, which would bring waves inland for the first time. Nick had a Eureka moment. And this was the start of his mythological quest to bring his concept of the wave to the United Kingdom. And it's been a really long journey for Nick, which involved. Every type of obstacle you can think of on his way to realize in this vision.

[00:02:29] I mean, you've got fundraising permits, global pandemic, shaky economy, Brexit. And he suffered a stroke. But Nick persevered and had succeeded in realizing his vision. And he pioneered a new business model while minimizing its environmental impact and offering an exceptional surf experience with the safe, inclusive space for all surfers. Now I was fortunate enough to sample the goods at the wave late last [00:03:00] year. And I can tell you it's one of the more enjoyable surfing experiences I've ever had.

[00:03:05] I mean, it's just incredible. It was a lot of positive energy. It's got a lot of fun things to it. It's got surf, it's got waves that are fun and playful. It's got a lot of positive people around. It's got this really cool app praise, ski vibe. And it makes it one of the more unique surfing experiences out there. I've been wanting to talk to Nick for some time we tried to schedule something last year.

[00:03:32] I was actually in the United Kingdom from work and I was trying to get to them, but there was a strike, so I couldn't get there. Um, and so the interview kept getting pushed off, but finally I got to him this spring. And oh my God, it was just so much fun to talk to him. And I'm so stoked to have him as a guest on this episode of the swell season surf podcast. I think a lot of you are going to find a lot of inspiration from this conversation gets stoked. And also, you may start to [00:04:00] question and think maybe I need to fly to Bristol and sample this wave.

[00:04:03] And it's really fun. So. Uh, we had a great conversation. I think you're really going to enjoy it. And, uh, yeah. And, uh, Nick was just so fun. Articulate. Great to talk to. Um, so yeah, enjoy this episode and we will see you on the other side. You.

[00:04:21] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: here on swell season. I'm super stoked to have you

[00:04:30] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: Yeah. Pleasure.

[00:04:31] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: I've,

[00:04:32] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: Good to see you,

[00:04:33] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: I've been following you for, for years since like before you even took off with the wave, you know, and just when you started it and just the, the level of passion that comes from you is, you Infectious, even through social media or online, you know, it's, it's really incredible.

[00:04:52] So I just want to give you credit for that. Like it's been inspiring watching like kind of your journey with it

[00:04:58] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: Thank you. Yeah, thank you. [00:05:00]Mm-Hmm?

[00:05:00] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: Um, I wanted to, to kind of. Dive in first, like, it feels like, wellness is like this common theme in your work, in your life, I think, you know, you, you, you were a osteopath before the wave, and, you know, it seems like you've always been kind of, In that kind of world of like trying to encourage health or promote health, you know And I was just curious first like where that that desire came from and where that that kind of um, You know that that openness to it all came from

[00:05:39] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: That's a good question. I don't think anybody's asked me that on a podcast

[00:05:43] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: finally All right, because every because you you've done the rounds and i'm like, oh man, what am I gonna ask that hasn't been asked

[00:05:49] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: that's a really good one. So, I guess, so I guess, um. Wellness, wellness. I totally accept that. That's, [00:06:00] that's a common theme in my life. Uh, I think I would expand that a little bit wider to just caring. So, um, you know, my, my dad was an osteopath. My mum was a counsellor. Uh, my sister's an osteopath. Um, my, uh, other sister, um, is a nurse.

[00:06:21] And I think that we've come through. The whole family, I think, comes from, uh, trying to give service to other people, caring, caring for other people. And a lot of us, um, have gone down the route of health, wellness, making sure that we can bring about, you know, try to improve, um, yeah, people's health and well being.

[00:06:44] So yeah, so I think that's I guess it's genetic. It's come through the family. I can also look at other other family members who've come from health care and wellness side. So I think that just naturally, it's a trait that's probably come through the [00:07:00] family. Um, and then and then obviously, from the wave perspective and, and trying to incorporate surfing and the ability to affect wellness and health in a completely different way.

[00:07:14] But something that, that's, it's kind of weird. Cause like if you talk, if you talk, if you talk to any surfer. About wellness and health. They just naturally know that it's there, that that's something that is synonymous, but it's, I think probably 10 years ago, it would never have been talked about. Whereas now it is talked about a lot more, I think probably post pandemic, it's been talked about a lot more.

[00:07:41] And, and now what's kind of cool is that, that Serping. Um, it's starting to get a really good reputation about looking after people's health and also planetary health together and how that ties in. And actually to have a healthy body, healthy mind to [00:08:00] go surfing is important, but actually you can only do that when you've got really healthy.

[00:08:05] environment to go surfing in. So then people go, well, you know, I'm, I'm having to, um, you know, surf in sewage outfall and that's no good. And, and it, and so then you start to get this lovely virtual circle of you look after your own health and wellbeing by looking after the environment. And then you start going, Oh, there's, there's something in here that is like, there's something here that, that, that ticks all the boxes about looking after my own personal health, other people's health, but also the planetary health at the same time.

[00:08:39] Um, so yeah, that's, I guess that's, that's, um, I guess that's where it came from initially is, is probably genetic. But, but, uh, but then speaking to people who are very like minded, a lot of people then go, yeah, that just makes sense. Like we've not talked about it in that, in that way, but it makes sense. Yeah,

[00:08:58] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: Like, I feel like [00:09:00] surfing is always like kind of, we've, we've like promoted that in some way. Right. Like you, you have the iconic image of like Jerry Lopez, Dick Brewer, Reno doing like yoga and, you know, like, uh, you know, in G land, you know, I had like a full wellness camp that was kind of promoted, but it wasn't taken seriously outside of.

[00:09:23] of surfing, really. And I would say, like, people like you have helped to legitimize that, perhaps? Like you, uh, E Ski Britain, uh, as well, and, and other people where there's, like, a bit more scientific kind of, uh, approach to it as well. And I, I'm curious, like, wave pool, particularly, has, have, has anyone ever proposed to you of, like, doing any sort of studies there?

[00:09:52] And using it because it is a controlled environment as well. And I'm curious, like, if anyone's approached you with sort of that kind [00:10:00] of, uh, proposition.

[00:10:01] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: 100%. Um, uh, University of Bristol, um, obviously where we're, where we're based, uh, we've already been doing research study. Uh, we've done an MSC, um, with an amazing woman, Adrienne. Um, and I think it's, it's been published already and we're looking to do a PhD study. Um, and it's about trying to understand, um, I guess, The relationship between being in and around water and how that affects people's health and wellbeing, because it's something that, you know, as surfers, we, we feel it.

[00:10:36] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: Mm

[00:10:36] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: But it's, it's, uh, up until now, it's been, you know, the amount of research and data around it has been, it's growing, but like we have exactly, as you say, we've created like the perfect control environment to show where we're taking people from inner city, some people who've never surfed or been in the water before in their life.

[00:10:58] We are [00:11:00] measuring their, I guess, their, their, their mental health and, and, and their physical health before. And then we're putting them on a six week course and then measuring it afterwards. And, and we, we've got, you know, we've got 150, 000 people coming here. Every single year, but if we can start to extrapolate that data, then that is just the most insane data set to go You know what?

[00:11:24] What we feel as surfers is Actually, this is backed up with research and actually then you go This is interesting because could we prescribe that, you know, can GPs prescribe that on the NHS or or, or even through, through the private healthcare system to go, you, you're depressed, you're anxious, you're, you know, um, theater, whatever it might be, you need, you know, I'm going to prescribe you, um, a six week course of surf therapy and just.

[00:11:53] go, go have fun and off the back of it, you know, let, let me know how, how, how you're doing off the back of [00:12:00] it, but we can research it. And most importantly, um, then people can self prescribe themselves. They're like, I'm feeling, I'm feeling down instead of reaching for alcohol or pills or whatever it might be.

[00:12:11] It's I actually, I'm going to go and get a dose of blue health. Like that, that's, that's my panacea. Yeah,

[00:12:18] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: so we can expect to see some MRI machines next to the, uh, you know, the sauna huts, you know, so like, come right out from a session, go in, like, see what's going on in the brain.

[00:12:32] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: Yeah, exactly. Well, there was another, uh, amazing, um, uh, somebody who works in the robotic, um, department in, uh, University of Bristol. And yeah, they've, they've, they're trying to design like a, a surf hat cap that they can put on so that it can actually in real time understand from a, um, from a neurological point of view.

[00:12:53] Like different neurons firing at different times and try to understand the pathway between You're [00:13:00] feeling good. You're feeling bad. You're feeling better What you know, what area of the brain is that affecting when you catch that wave or maybe not catch the wave and actually? Talking or chilling like how?

[00:13:14] You know, what's that pathway neurologically, you know, which bit of the brain is that tapping into so that we can further understand, you know, how, how can we get that almost that sort of blue health pill? Like, how can we do that? Um, and yeah, uh, uh, and try and do it as naturally as possible to improve people's health and well being.

[00:13:34] But

[00:13:34] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: you have, unless you have a bad session, you know, and you keep falling. Then it, then, you know, it's like, Oh man.

[00:13:40] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: exactly, you know, you just, and you just don't know, like, then is the overcoming the fact that you've fallen 20 times and then got up once, is, does that actually supercharge you? Actually, is it even better than actually if you'd had quite an all right session? So it's like, it's just so much out there that you just, [00:14:00] we just don't know.

[00:14:01] And actually, at least it's around the sort of pretty cool, cool place to be. And, and, and equally, you can just turn up there and just. Just have fun. Just do what you do at the beach. Just have fun. Yeah,

[00:14:13] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: the, uh, you know, capitalist, uh, salesperson in me sees that. And I want to be like, Oh, I'm going to put that on, uh, people and then be like, look, see how much happier you were on this surfboard as opposed to this. Like, Oh, you know, the, the long fish clearly suits your mental health.

[00:14:31] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: Yeah, yeah. Well, I think everybody would suddenly start picking up, um, mid length. A bit of mid length exploration even more than it is at the moment. Like, yeah, you're just gonna be happy. You're gonna just be happy on that.

[00:14:43] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: know, I know,

[00:14:45] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: shortboards would just decline.

[00:14:47] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: my, my, you know, midlife crisis has been like, oh man, I have to go bigger, I have to go thicker, okay, I'm admitting, this is, this is life now.

[00:14:59] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: It's a mid [00:15:00] crisis. There's nothing wrong with that. True.

[00:15:02] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: I, I also see what you're doing here with the ruse at the study, you know, because now it's like, oh yeah, we need more wave pools around the UK for mental health, you know, we have the study to back it.

[00:15:15] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: Well, you know, and honestly, you look at some of the, some of the money that that gets, um, gets spent, uh, on the NHS, just you start going, well, yeah, actually pro prevention is always better than trying to seek, um, seek a cure. So, you know, to me, anything, anything that, you know, enables people to look after their own health.

[00:15:37] That's great. The fact that we can do it through surfing, which is something that obviously we absolutely love then. Well, that's just like win win in my eyes.

[00:15:46] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: And, and this is like called blue health, right? If I'm not mistaken, it was called like, uh, it's the emerging field of blue health I was reading, that's what you kind of are calling this.

[00:15:56] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: Yeah, it's just, um, yeah, it's just a sort of growing body of research, [00:16:00] um, which, you know, definitely, um, iskey who's one of my dearest friends, um, myself and various other people. It's really sort of, um, trying to, to push. And ultimately is about people looking after their own health. And if you can do it through being in blue environments, it's not not for everyone, but we know that there is a real connection neurologically and instinctively to blue as a color, but also water.

[00:16:30] Waves, um, being by the ocean, uh, and, you know, but equally for some people, it's, it's green. It might be, it might be going out into fields and trees or it might be climbing a mountain, but actually it's just around making nature, uh, the panacea, the thing that makes people feel better. Um, and just try to understand it a bit more.

[00:16:50] And just try to encourage more people to do it. Um, you know, we all know that, um, how the pandemic fared with everybody's, um, physical and mental health [00:17:00] because everybody's locked in, no nature, uh, just glued to, um, uh, you know, screens and all the rest of it. So we've actually done this incredible global experiment already, but we know that that was a bit rubbish.

[00:17:15] So can we now do that instead? Um, and, and yeah, and, and be real proponents of trying to change the way that people, um, talk, talk about their health as well. Lots of people talking about mental health issues post pandemic, and that's a really good thing. Um, it isn't, isn't the sort of, um, you know, the thing that nobody could talk about.

[00:17:39] Um, so, and, and, and that's all good as well, but if we can ultimately just do it,

[00:17:45] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: Yeah.

[00:17:45] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: For me, through surfing, which fundamentally is fricking cool anyway, I just love it. Like, well, it's just win win as I say, it's just, yeah, you're looking after your health and at the same time you're having a hell of fun and you're building [00:18:00] connections and community and, and all the rest of it.

[00:18:03] And, and there are definitely some things in the surf industry and the surf community. that also can be improved. Um, you know, getting, getting more accessibility, more accessibility for women, making sure that we're, there's a better community, people who talk to each other than rather than sneering each other on, on breaks.

[00:18:23] It's like, actually, this is, this is, there's amazing pockets of community that could be developed there. It already happens down at the coast, but if we can encourage more of that, it's all good.

[00:18:34] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: I'm curious, like, uh, two things I wanna touch on here. You said were really interesting, um, that community aspect, right? Like. I've gotten to experience your, you know, your wave. And it's amazing, like how the groups all kind of become that community when they paddle out. Right. Like, especially for a lot of first timers, I feel like it's definitely like.[00:19:00]

[00:19:00] You go out, you're, you're all kind of nervous. You don't know what to expect. And there's other people in the same boat or some people who've been there. And I don't know, like it, it, it, it's so different in some ways to surfing in the ocean where there's a scare, scarcity mentality more. And, and this is like, Oh, we're all going to get our waves and we're all going to do fine.

[00:19:24] So there's none of that kind of that level of friction there. And it allows everyone to kind of, you know, talk to each other so much more. And, and, um, it's interesting. I wonder like if you've ever seen that effect. Translate from like the pool to the ocean. Um, you know, where people who have might've met at the wave and if they've go surfing now out in the ocean and part two of that is, do you know how many people who've like learned at the wave or taken a lesson in the wave and, and like what percentage of them have gone to the ocean and continue to surf in the ocean?

[00:19:59] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: Yeah, to the [00:20:00] second point, that's a really good, that's a really good point. And I think that we definitely don't capture that information. It'd be interesting to capture that information without a doubt.

[00:20:08] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: rate would be fascinating. You know,

[00:20:11] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: yeah, we know our conversion rate for people coming back and all the rest of it, but going going over to the coast Um is is is an interesting one.

[00:20:20] Um, so I don't have data on that. I don't I don't I don't even have a feel for it. Um, but I do Going back to your first question in terms of building a community. We definitely know there's pockets of communities that built around the wave. We've got like really cool bodyboarding club. I've got a whole group that meet on a Friday afternoon and it's always just on logs, which is like super cool.

[00:20:45] It's got to be at least nine foot logs. Um, and so that, that, that happens every Friday. Um, there's definitely the sort of barrels, um, eight o'clock in the morning sessions, then. It seems to be that they all go, you know, particularly the left [00:21:00] hand side for some reason always gets booked up and, and it's just like, like a really good, um, vibe in the water.

[00:21:06] People understand, you know, the kind of rules of the pool, so to speak, and the etiquette and all the rest of it. But there's no, there's no harassing. What's great, I guess, is I probably more see it in on social media where I've got a whole load of our wave makers, our staff. going for a surf and they're hooking up with, um, some of our regular surfers.

[00:21:29] And, and I believe that, um, from, from what I hear is that it creates just a really cool vibe in the water. So there's a couple of spots near us within an hour where, um, where they, it's probably the closest hit you can, um, get to the ocean. And you can see that they've all met up just By coincidence, but actually as soon as that happens is it kind of creates a really great vibe in the water.

[00:21:54] Um, so yeah, so I think it does happen. I think it's something that we could probably encourage even [00:22:00] more. But at the moment it's just happening organically, which, you know, I dig the thought of the fact that that just happens by itself. Um, And, you know, going back to a previous point, and this is really important, is that, um, uh, seeing places, uh, down by the coast, and there, there, particularly there's, um, a couple of places, I've been lucky enough to go to one recently called Blue Zones, places where, like, um, people are, they're healthiest and they're happiest, um, there's like five Blue Zones in the world, um, and I went to Costa Rica recently to try and really Try and understand, well, is it because the climate's amazing?

[00:22:40] Or is it like they're very active or they're eating healthily or what have you? And actually, the more and more you dig into it, it was around the community aspects. So all of these pockets of, of, of longevity hotspots of people who live longer and happier. Um, the most important thing is connection, [00:23:00] connection to people.

[00:23:01] It wasn't, I was expecting it was going to be, you know, climate. I guess living in, living in, in the UK, you always think you can claim it for everything, actually it was, it was bringing together communities, pockets of communities who support each other. Um, and it was really interesting to see it firsthand in that particular place.

[00:23:22] And, but then realize that, It's something that we can deliver in the UK, in, in, in the furthest, furthest flung places. If you bring people together who are like minded, right minded, who care about the same things, actually that's the, the secret to longevity. Because you get support, you get to be able to talk to people, you don't feel lonely, you don't feel isolated, you exercise together, you eat together, you, for some people, pray together, whatever it might be, but there's a real, um, communion of people.

[00:23:57] Um, and I think it's something that we've, [00:24:00] Organically happened at the wave, uh, and the wave pool. But I think it's something that we could be encouraging even more. And I'd love to see in like five, 10 years time, these, these pockets like grow and grow and grow. And it becomes again, that sort of real, real health hotspot, um, for people.

[00:24:19] And again, like plays into that sort of blue health blue zone. We're going right. We found how people can live longer and be happier. Yeah. How can we create spaces, places, and communities that can do that more? And again, doing it through surfing is like, would be so cool as well.

[00:24:38] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: Well, it's, it's interesting because I remember like when, when, uh, Slater's wave wave first shown and you know, and all of a sudden like all these wave pool technology started to come out. And there was, um, an initial fear, I think, amongst a lot of older surfers, like, What's that gonna do for the [00:25:00]culture?

[00:25:00] What's it gonna do for this? There was, like, people who were like, I'm never gonna surf in a wave pool, because it's not real, or whatever that is. And there was, like, so much fear around it, I feel like. And Now that we are now probably like a decade into it, I think this, this wave pool boom, I would call it, um, we're, we're starting to see how, um, the, the unintended, uh, benefits have really started to show.

[00:25:31] And I think like this community aspect is one of them for sure, uh, that, that really is starting to come out. And I think it's the right time because surfing has exploded with popularity and we used to have community when it was smaller, when there were less surfers in the water, you would know more people, right?

[00:25:52] Because it's just easier. And then as it's exploded with popularity, it's become harder and harder to get to know that community, [00:26:00] right? Like because of that scarcity of waves and everything. And I think like the wave pool. And the, the, the surge, surge of like board rider clubs and other things like that, I think are, are lifeline to, to getting that community feeling back, you know, like surfing used to feel a lot smaller and now it's much bigger.

[00:26:21] And these are the ways we need to kind of, you know, keep, to keep that core ideal or that core, uh, energy. These are the ways I think we're going to have to explore and do it.

[00:26:33] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: Yeah, no, I totally agree. Look, it's just, it's just like whenever we do anything like the wave or other surf parks, it's gotta be done with profound respect for, for the community that's already been there. In the past and, and make sure that we're not doing any kind of disservice to that, that it doesn't go down an uber sort of capitalist march down.

[00:26:58] Let's just, let's [00:27:00] just take the money out of surfing and, and, and bludgeon it and get the best, best that we can out. So it's just, it's just about humility and respect. Um, of the culture that we've come from because it is a cool culture. It's a, it's a counterculture as well. It's like it, it's never was never meant to be, you know, mainstream.

[00:27:21] So I think trying to do it respectfully is, is so, so important. Um, But equally, you know, um, the world is constantly changing is, is like, you know, you, you, you, anything that's worth protecting is normally not going to be a secret for that long. Um, and it's like the surfing has been the best kept secret. It seems like for centuries almost.

[00:27:47] Um, and yeah, it's trying to do it, uh, respectfully. And I think, you know, you can even see, you can even see companies who've Done it disrespectfully and actually they won't stand the test of [00:28:00] time. Yeah, they might make a, they might make a few million or multiple millions, um, over a few years, but it's all very short lived.

[00:28:08] Actually the, um, the companies are doing it well, are looking much more. As a legacy, like we're, we're, we're respectful for where we've come from. We're respectful for where we want to get to, and we're not going to kind of crap on the surf industry or surf culture to get where we want to. And the ones that are doing really well are doing it respectfully and the ones that might make a quick buck.

[00:28:32] Um, but actually they're not standing the test of time and that feels right. Um, uh, so, you know, from, from our perspective, particularly from the surf industry, from a wave pool industry, we have to be like super respectful for it. And then also making sure. We're doing it the right way. So, you know, looking at, you know, the energy transition, making sure that we're not like, you know, we're not, we're not killing some kind of coral reef somewhere else in the [00:29:00] world just to get our energy, to be able to make, um, fake waves is like, we've got, we've got to be respectful to those kinds of things.

[00:29:07] Um, and yeah, for me, that that's part of my mission is about, right. We built, we built this amazing place. There are more popping up, but actually how can we. like nice pressure on that wave pool industry to just make the right choices. Yeah. It might, it might mean that your payback for your private investors might be an extra year, but actually let's, let's commit to doing the right thing because it's better in the longterm.

[00:29:34] Um,

[00:29:36] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: Yeah. So, that brings me to another question then, like, is, what do you think is the best model then for the wave pool? Industry because I'm seeing things like people who want to build resorts like or or um, Not even resorts like real estate and the money seems to be in the real estate around the wave pool Than the actual wave pool and things of that [00:30:00] nature Um, i'm seeing here in new york.

[00:30:02] They want to build a very exclusive club that's going to cost thirty thousand dollars to join you know, so i'm i'm curious like your perspective then on like where how the direction of the of this wave pool and Uh, industry should go and, you know, do you see yourself as like, um, a leader in that, in that world?

[00:30:25] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: no, I mean, just, I would say in terms of the leader thing, it's just, it's just because, I was one of the first people to, to, to, to help get, you know, get one built and commercially open. Um, so in terms of leading, I guess, you know, I would say that I've been leading the charge with my team to do that. Uh, and that's great.

[00:30:47] And we've obviously, we're quite far ahead of the curve for other people. So we've done most of the, we've been the guinea pig for so long, along the way, we have felt all the pains, uh, along the [00:31:00] way. Um, But equally, we're able to, to understand, you know, the knowledge that we've, we've, we've found is, is incredible across the team.

[00:31:08] It really is. Um, I would say that. At the moment, like if you're looking very, very high level, um, there aren't many surf pools that have been built still that can show, demonstrate, um, a real commercial payback on what they're doing. So, um, until that's done, I would say that we're at the moment. One of the only ones I don't know.

[00:31:36] I don't know all the facts and figures, um, the finances of all the other surf parks at the moment, but I would say that we're probably, uh, one of the only ones that have shown that we can be a profitable venture in its own right. Um, to do that, um, or to be able to build lots and lots of these is that there is then going to be a huge amount of risk until, until you've got a [00:32:00] proven model that you can actually show that you can make money.

[00:32:03] Um, by doing one of these and it can stand on its own two feet, um, then there will always be a bit of a punt, so to speak, or a bit of a bit of risk in there and the best way to de risk anything is probably to tie it into real estate. So I think that these in the, in the, the will and the thrust and the need to build surf parks out as quickly as possible within the industry, it's Is that it's really leaning heavily towards real estate because you can, you can pin your, you can pin your bottom dollar to it.

[00:32:35] You know that real estate will sell. And so if you, if you pre sell that real estate and you raise that money to be able to build the pool. Or you can increase the, the, the, um, uh, you can increase the price of that, of that real estate because there is a pool attached to it. Then that's probably the quickest way of getting it built because otherwise you've just got to [00:33:00] wait for somebody else to prove that model to them, able to just go to a bank or be able to go to pension fund or what have you to be able to raise that capital.

[00:33:11] So, um, I think that answer your question is that fundamentally at the moment it's whatever can get it built and the only way Unless you know, unless you really understand the finances of running a surf park the only real way of Leveraging that finance is through a real estate play Um, and actually it's nice because you end up selling an amazing space with a surfboard attached and all the rest of it.

[00:33:40] But to me, it becomes an exclusive resort. So it's a bit like the golf, you know, it's a bit like the golf resort model where a certain number of people will be able to benefit from it. But actually, it just becomes an exclusive, um, resort for, for the rich and the famous and all the rest of it. [00:34:00]Is, is that, is that impacting like in term, in terms of purpose that will make me or other people lots of money, but is that why I'm in there?

[00:34:10] Uh, I'm here, you know, I'm here to benefit from the hard work that I might have put into a project, um, and it would be great to be able to pay my mortgage and, and all the rest of it, but ultimately I'm in this to change people's lives. Health and well being.

[00:34:29] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: I I sometimes wonder why, um, towns, villages, or even cities don't create a public access version of the wave pool, because to me, that seems like a way to help increase your, your local economy and your, you know, local real estate even, right? Like, I would move inland. If there were wave pools that I knew I could access, I would move to so many other places, uh, if I knew I could get waves and I would move somewhere more affordable.

[00:34:58] And, and so with [00:35:00] that, that train of thought, I wonder then like, have you, you know, I'm sure you communicate with your local politicians in Bristol. And I'm curious, like what the impact the wave has had on the city and the area around it, uh, economically, and also for the society and group as well.

[00:35:20] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: Yeah, again, another really good question. I would say I'll just summarize it as being that they're proud. I think the Bristol region and South Gloucestershire region are proud. They're proud to have something that is quite cutting edge, a little bit bonkers. Um, suddenly, you know, a slice of ocean slapped inland right next to their city or their county.

[00:35:41] They're really proud of it. Um, and yeah, of course it drives other economic benefits and creates jobs and creates community. It's a reason for people to sort of celebrate and come together. Yeah. Um, and going back to your previous question, um, I just think we're [00:36:00] really early. Um, the, you know, your question about why, why is, why is this not being done?

[00:36:06] You know, why, you know, why are counties and, and cities haven't, why have they not done that yet? I think they will. I think that there needs to be, um, and this goes back to our previous question, which was around research and data. It's because research All those kind of things need, need to be data backed.

[00:36:24] So if we can prove, you know, if we've got a cohort of say, 150, 000 surfers coming to the wave every year, if we've got empirical, empirical data that shows that there is an X percent uplift in their health and well being, um, for coming there, And you can tie in the economic benefits and creation of jobs and all the visitor economy and all those kind of things Then you can go to cities Um boroughs and go this is what we can deliver.

[00:36:55] Yeah, it's cool attractive It's a slice of the ocean, but actually [00:37:00] these are the long term benefits and it's going to solve some of your Issues that you might have around, you know, health provision or mental health provision or getting people exercise and all the rest of it. So you need to build up a case to be able to do that.

[00:37:17] You know, and I would, I would love exactly as you say, is, is, is to get to a point where maybe 10, 15 years where you can go, right, we've got all that data collected. We've got this incredible place and space that we can build. Um, and actually we can, you know, draw maybe some private finance to it, but also some government finance, local authority, uh, health care provision, um, pension funds, and actually pull together a much more sort of holistic view on the future.

[00:37:50] An amazing surf place, place to go surfing fundamentally, but actually deliver blue health that will affect people's health and well being [00:38:00] across cities, you know, all across the world. But I just think, you know, in answer to your question, it's, it's, it's so, we're so at the beginning, so at the beginning.

[00:38:10] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: I, I wonder if you, it might make sense to partner with like people who build skate parks as well, because I know in the US at least like that's become such a big thing for local communities to build out where these skate parks, you know, which like, um, in New York, we had Andy Kessler, who was a big proponent of that back in the day.

[00:38:30] He was a old OG skater and, you know, he was, Really lobbying the city to build these skate parks as a place of recreation for kids to go. And I wonder if you could pull that data too, to, to fold it into what you're doing. Cause that would be, cause I mean, those two are peanut butter and jelly right there.

[00:38:48] Or, or Marmite and toast. Sorry. Um, forgot.

[00:38:52] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: Yeah, and I totally, you know, at the end of the day, it's, it's, it's being able to, yeah, provide, provide [00:39:00] an incredible space and a place for people to be able to be naturally active rather than having to, um, rely on necessarily technology, like getting back outside, even, even, you know, even a concrete, um, skate bowl, you're still outside, you're still out in the fresh air.

[00:39:16] Uh, and again, going back to a previous point, it's. Community is like you're pulling people together. People who will be looking out for each other. People will actually have conversations with each other. The, when you're going through bad times, you go, actually kind of things aren't so great at home or just be able to just get people talking to each other rather than Snapchatting and messaging each other.

[00:39:39] It's like actually proper conversation, create communities around it. So anything that creates community, I think, is just, is great and if you can get as many pockets of that as possible, people who love eating, people who love walking, people who love, um, watching water rather than even being in it, um, yeah, the more people you can groups together, [00:40:00] um, then you just create that sort of common thread, common conversation.

[00:40:04] And I think that, well, we know that that is, um, That's the answer to a lot of people's health and well being, is just connection, don't be lonely, um, and have fun in nature.

[00:40:16] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: I can't wait for the day where I could come up with the surf therapy Discipline and be a therapist and watch someone surf come in and then be like, yeah You know that off the lip looked a little soft. What's going on at home? What can we talk about?

[00:40:28] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: Yeah, exactly. Exactly.

[00:40:31] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: How great would that be like to have a surf therapy Therapist come out of the water and be like, no, but what's really going on

[00:40:37] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: Yeah,

[00:40:37] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: I saw your cutbacks looked a little dull. Like,

[00:40:40] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: Yeah. Mm hmm. Mm

[00:40:43] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: you know, that's one of the, one of the things also I have to commend you on, you know, I've, I've been to a few wave pools, but you know, yours really stood out to me was the apres. Of the surf, right? Like it had a apres [00:41:00] ski vibe to it, which, you know, like in the, I don't know, maybe in the U S it's a little different.

[00:41:05] Like in the U S it feels like everything is very controlled. Everyone is worried about getting sued. So everything is like very, a lot more rigid and what you can and can't do. And what I found at your way, it was like, it felt so much more relaxed. Is is the way I would say it like no one was was tense.

[00:41:23] No one was yelling or screaming It was all really calm inviting and and what I also noticed were how many people were there who don't surf who were just there with their kids like wanting an outdoor space to hang out and have a drink and watch the surfers like it was Amazing how many non surfers I saw there.

[00:41:43] I think I saw almost more non surfers than surfers in some ways.

[00:41:47] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: Well, I mean, yeah. I mean, uh, you know, the lake has got a defined capacity. We can't, you know, one, once it's full, it's full, so to speak. Whereas obviously our entire site, we can invite lots of people there. And, and that's [00:42:00] about making sure that there's other reasons to stay. So a lot of what we talk about is we're surfing, but not just surfing.

[00:42:06] Is it, it's again, the reason the pool, why people might come and visit, like curiosity, you know, even if you're non surf, you go. But I've kind of heard this, there's this slice of ocean in the middle of the countryside. Like, I kind of want to go and have a look at it. Oh, and while I'm there, there's like some good cafe and the kids can go on the swings and slides and they can skateboard or what have you.

[00:42:30] So reasons to stay. Um, but I think that that's something that, you know, was always there from the beginning is, is it was all around surfing, but equally it's nothing about surfing. So for me. Um, like the vision of the space in the place, it didn't even because I didn't, you know, the technology didn't even exist when I was starting on this mission to try and create a space.

[00:42:52] It was, it was going to be around water because I love water. Could have been a lake, could have been a river trying to find somewhere. The fact that complete [00:43:00] serendipity, um, the technology got released. Like within the month of me pulling together this vision of a space and place that involves surfing Which is my biggest love and has been for 45 years.

[00:43:12] So I with this it there's bonkers. I've got this amazing Vision and actually the fact that we can stitch surfing into it as well is is like is, is perfect, but it was always around how can we bring people together outdoors in green, blue space to be able to find the best version of themselves and the fact that we can do it through surfing is just, um, it is, you know, to me, that's the, that's the cherry on the top really.

[00:43:44] Um, So yeah, so it's so, you know, and it's hard like trying to get that, like if you were to come and visit us right at the beginning, we were probably like rabbits in headlights. We were probably overly safety cautious, like [00:44:00] really worried that because we just built something that nobody knew how to operate, how to operate safely.

[00:44:07] We were properly, like I said, um, uh, guinea pigs for this. Uh, and there's some things that have, you know, we got wrong and things that we got very, very right. In fact, thankfully, like nothing, nothing horribly wrong. You know, nobody's like, um, uh, really come a mischief there, but it was like, yeah, but we, we felt like we were just a big experiment, but luckily we've, you know, along the way and, um, And by the time you came and visited last, last year is that there's a real balance between we absolutely have to get that sort of safety aspect right because fundamentally you're surfing in a concrete lake like a, like a reef break and you're learning to surf in something like that.

[00:44:52] So we have to take absolute care and precaution, but equally, there's a way in which you can. You can [00:45:00] deliver that message of safety and and being cautious whilst realizing it's equally, um, a risk, a risky sport, you know, it's, it's, it's a risk, risk, um, going down to the beach and surfing. So it's just trying to mitigate as much as possible, making sure that we're delivering all that safety to people.

[00:45:20] But equally, there is, is always a risk in, in life, uh, and, and, and people have to be, have to accept. Um, uh, that risk and try and make it equally as relaxed as possible. And then when they leave the place, because obviously you've got or leave the lake, you're so exhilarated from what you've just said, it becomes infectious.

[00:45:41] So you've got the next people coming into the lake who are looking at the smiles of the people going out of the lake and it just becomes a self perpetuating, um, kind of. Frothy like pool. It's like, yeah, you can see throughout the day. Like people arrive in the morning. They're quite knackered. [00:46:00] Um, because it's, it's really, really early, but of course they've just, it's normally the barrel session.

[00:46:04] So they're coming out going like, Oh my goodness, I've just got the biggest barrel in my life. And all the rest of it. And you can see throughout the day just to kind of just. Keeps crescendoing. It's like the real like froth is at the beginning and they're so stoked and then they and then they just infect the next people and the next people and the next people and and then you've got wave makers our staff in there like Constantly really happy and and trying to do the best to please people you're going actually It's just there's just loads of smiles around here.

[00:46:36] It's so good. Just feels good

[00:46:40] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: like, I think that one of the biggest thing is, is your team there? Like you have an incredible staff, like they, it was really incredible service. I will say that. And I, and I was curious, like what you attribute to that, because, you know, I'm curious, like, did you have management history in the [00:47:00] past? Um, you know, and had you worked in building community like that with, with, with staff and workers, because that's a real gift that not everyone can learn or do.

[00:47:11] And, and, um, I'm curious where that came from, uh, because it's, it's incredible. Like the people were hospitable, were nice, friendly, no, there was no jadedness, no aggroness, nothing. It was really impressive.

[00:47:27] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: Yeah, thanks. Thanks that feedback. Um Well, it's definitely not, not just, just me. I think, I think as a leader, you, you, you set the tone on something, uh, and you set a tone through, you know, the senior leadership team and the management and all the rest of it. And I think it goes back to that, um, that caring, it's just showing that you fundamentally care.

[00:47:49] And if you care about our staff, then that will just reflect into the community and your customers and all the rest of it. So I absolutely don't subscribe to this sort of. [00:48:00] right kind of thing. Actually, our staff are always right. We always, we should always be backing them, um, to be doing the best that they can.

[00:48:08] Um, and, and that then gets reflected in the customer experience. So it's like really, really caring for, for our staff and showing that we do care. Um, and we could probably. Care more. We would always want to pay more or give more holiday and all those kind of things, but actually fundamentally showing that we, we respect them.

[00:48:34] We like their, you know, we, we listen to their ideas. We try and keep them informed as much as possible, um, through everything. Um, but ultimately it's down to that care bit. And I guess that's the bit that probably has come from my previous job being an osteopath is that 24 hours a day, or at least every day that I'm, I'm at work, you are a hundred percent caring for an individual in front of you.

[00:48:58] And that person has to be the [00:49:00] most, The most important person in your, in your life at that moment. And I think as a leader and as a senior leadership team, when we're talking to our staff, they need to be the most important thing at that time, whether it's good or bad, it's like they are important and we need to be there to either, you know, even, even when you have to reprimand them, it's like, yeah, but you're there, you're focused, you're, you're showing that you actually care about them.

[00:49:27] Um, and then that just gets reflected into customers. Um, and yeah, we obviously train, train customers, all the rest of it. But ultimately, I think it's the way that people look after your staff. And this goes across any, any industry is like, look after your staff, realize that they are the most important.

[00:49:46] Treasured asset that you have got it under your care and you and you do care for them and we're lucky to have them in our care and treat them like that then that just gets reflected across across [00:50:00] teams across customers. Um, so, and it's tricky. It is tricky. And a lot of people have come from, from industries and come to work at the way, particularly at management level, who've not come from a caring environment at all.

[00:50:14] They love what they've, you know, that what's attractive to them to come to the wave and work at the wave is that they, they realize there's something really special about working there, but sometimes they can also bring their baggage of, Other organizations work for, and it's like trying to sort of meet their expectations of what's gone before and going, that's how you've been treated before, but actually you're now, you're now under the wave and the wave cares about our staff because that will reflect in the customer service.

[00:50:45] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: I want to, um, go back in time now and I'm curious like how you started surfing, how you got into it, and like that whole kind of journey. What were the influences that, that led you [00:51:00] where you are now? But I'm curious like where, where, where'd you start to surf? What was that like? And, and who were those influences

[00:51:08] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: Yeah. So my, my influence, um, was my dad without a doubt. So, um, uh, I was the, the only son, um, got two, two sisters. Uh, and I guess my dad was equally my best mate. You know, it's, it's, it's, it's who you spend all your weekends with, you know, other, other than other friends, but you know, everything that he loved to do, I love to do.

[00:51:31] Um, and, um, And, you know, and normally it was around water. So we'd be fishing, sailing, surfing. Um, my, my family, um, particularly my dad's family always grew up by the sea. Um, so a lot of them were from, um, from the Gower, um, in Wales, uh, or down, um, in Cornwall. Um, and so there's a bit of a, sort of, again, a bit of a heritage of, of, um, People just going to water.

[00:51:59] [00:52:00] Um, uh, and yeah, that's something that I've just grown up with since, since day dot. And so we went to, we went to Cornwall every, every summer, um, for holidays. Uh, and my grandma lived down in the South coast. So at weekends we would often come visit her. And so it was always just chimping around in water, um, either, yeah, sailing, boating, fishing.

[00:52:21] And so my first, my first waves I caught, um, I've got some very old grainy, um, cine camera, um, Super 8, Super 8 video of me standing on a surfboard for the first time when I was about four or five. Um, but then used to, used to go onto the South coast beaches, um, just surf off the breakwaters, um, with, um, With whatever craft I could.

[00:52:48] Um, and I just knew that that's something that I just, I just absolutely loved. And then when I moved to Bristol, which was quite a few years later when I was in, in early twenties, um, [00:53:00]that's why I moved to Bristol. One, my wife was, um, uh, here, but equally, it was the perfect gateway access to all of the coast, uh, in, um, Cornwall, Devon and, and Wales.

[00:53:12] Um, and that's when I really kind of. Yeah, I, I, I, I work to surf. I literally would do. back to back, like long, long, long days working three days a week, but then give myself four days surfing afterwards. Uh, and it was brilliant. Those are the glory days where, where I was like absolute stink. Um, but it then meant I would have four days off, just go off in my camper and do four day weekends, um, surfing as much as possible.

[00:53:44] It was so, that

[00:53:44] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: Did your wife surf? Does your wife surf?

[00:53:47] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: She hates, she hates surfing. She hates waves. Her idea of perfection, her idea of perfection is, is the Mediterranean, like absolutely still warm water. Um, [00:54:00] that's cool. But she gets it. I mean, she's, she's, she's lived with me for too long to understand. She, she understands.

[00:54:07] Completely what the surfer feeling is the thing that I get from, from surfing. She understands totally what that is. Um, even if she doesn't necessarily, you know, um, do it herself. So, and she's got a very, very great understanding of like surf culture and what's why, right. What's wrong. And she's an osteopath as well.

[00:54:30] So she understands that health benefits side of it as well. Um, but it is ironic that she absolutely hates waves.

[00:54:38] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: No, it's, it, it, that's hilarious. Yeah, my wife doesn't, doesn't even swim, you know? So

[00:54:44] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: Yeah.

[00:54:44] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: it's like, I, did she ever refer to surfing as your mistress?

[00:54:51] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: No, probably used to. I think, yeah, I think, I think that's why we got married is like, right. Well, kind [00:55:00] of like the only way I need to lock this guy in because otherwise I'm going to lose him to surfing. Um, but actually, yeah, it's kind of, it's kind of worked. And without a doubt, once, you know, once I started on this mission to bring the wave, she's like, I can totally understand.

[00:55:16] It's like, you, yeah. You know, you're always hankering to be by the coast and, um, because of our, you know, our osteopathic practice and stuff like that, we were very, very fixed in Bristol. She knew that was always going to be the pull. I always want to go down to the coast. And then the fact that I, you know, I guess that's part of, Part of the entrepreneurial mindset is like, right, well, if I can't go to the coast, like the coast,

[00:55:43] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: bringing it to me.

[00:55:46] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: actually, you know, necessity being the mother invention and all the rest of it is, yeah, maybe, maybe that's, you know, if, if I'd managed to move to, to Cornwall or Devon, the wave would never have happened.

[00:55:59] So [00:56:00] actually anyways, it's quite good that I was so driven to want to surf more and to. Try and combine surfing with the healthcare side, like, okay, well, let's just bring it in. Let's, let's bring in land. Let's do it.

[00:56:15] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: I, I got to ask then, cause I find, I think this is an interesting topic amongst surfers, particularly is how do you balance that passion and drive that you have for surfing with your passion and love for your partner and your family too? Like I, I always find it to be a very delicate balancing act, right?

[00:56:38] Like with obsession. And, and love, right? Like those are two things that kind of get intertwined, but also create issues, you know, uh, because you could be so one track minded at times. Um, what have you done to help balance that and be mindful of that, you know, and so that you can [00:57:00] take care of the other aspects of your life.

[00:57:03] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: Yeah. Again, a really good, good question. Um,

[00:57:07] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: these zingers to you, man. Boom!

[00:57:10] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: it's really good. Like, you know, you know, we, we talk about it in a glib way at times, but you know, surfing is an addiction without a doubt. Um, for, for a lot of people anyway. Um, and like all addictions, it's just got to be really carefully managed. Um, there isn't, there is, there is not, there is, there is no right or wrong, because if you just stop doing it, you know, that you will become incredibly miserable.

[00:57:36] Cool. You know, if you do it too much, it's, it's too much. Actually it becomes, it becomes, you're all encompassing everything. And actually that's not healthy as well. So I would, I would look at it like any, any drug or like alcohol or something like that is that it's, it's trying to get that right balance of moderation whereby your.[00:58:00]

[00:58:00] It's bringing out the best in you, so to speak. Um, um, but it doesn't bring out the worst in you. Uh, and I've definitely, I've definitely been on both sides of that equation without a doubt. And I don't like either side of it and trying to find, and I think it's quite a broad middle ground. It's just not going too far one way or going too far the other way.

[00:58:23] Um, so, and I guess it's just being mindful around though, where, where those limits are really. Um, and, um, but it's a, it's a, it's a, it's a really good question. And, and then, and then I guess about communication is, is really allowing your partner to understand how important that that is to you and actually how you will be a better person.

[00:58:48] And not using it as a blackmail. I will be a better person if you let me go surfing loads. Because that's, that's just crap. But, yeah, but without a doubt, you know, there have been [00:59:00]times in my life where, you know, my wife's looked at me, um, and she's just looked at me in the eyes and go, you need to go for a surf.

[00:59:07] I was like, what? And I'm not even asking for it anymore because I'm so in, in whatever I'm doing, um, you know, work wise or whatever it is. Um, I've almost like kicked surfing into touch because I've been so focused on whatever, whatever that particular thing is. And she said. You just need to go for a surf.

[00:59:29] I just know you need to go for a surf. Um, and I have, and a number of times, um, particularly when the kids were younger or just pre kids to go, I feel like I've gotten it back. Um, so, and I, and I think that that, and again, that comes to, you know, good communication and real good understanding of actually.

[00:59:48] This is, and it goes back still to the sort of blue health, this is the thing that keeps me sane. This is the thing that really keeps me on track. Um, and, and tell me, tell [01:00:00] me to stop forever at your peril because you will, you will see a horrible person and not because I'm, I want to be horrible. It's because it's because I need, this is something that just keeps me really, really happy.

[01:00:13] Um, and to, and to deny that happiness. For anyone, um, particularly somebody that you love. Isn't great. And in the same way, you know, my wife, she's not a surfer, but she does other things that really makes her happy. And if I was to ask her to stop seeing friends or going to places or, um, you know, um, visiting places, or you mustn't, you mustn't go on, mustn't go on a trip with your friends to a city ever again.

[01:00:42] Well, that that's just rubbish. That's just, you know, yeah. So, so I think that that's it. It's just understanding that this isn't just. Hobby isn't just a sport. It's something that actually keeps people sane and healthy. Um, and, and as soon as you can communicate that and [01:01:00] allow the other person to understand that, then why, why would they want to stop you from doing that?

[01:01:06] And for us, as surfers, is understanding the boundaries of if you do it too little, you're probably going to feel rubbish. If you do it too, too much, you're probably going to make other people feel rubbish. And somewhere in the middle is probably the happy medium.

[01:01:22] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: I feel like as I've gotten older and started to enter into middle age, I can't surf too much because my body won't handle it. So it actually automatically makes me stay in stasis almost, you know?

[01:01:35] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: Yeah, I don't think you know, you know, I I've I've seen it massively over probably the last five years and probably the wave helps with that is I do properly get enjoyment seeing other people having fun. So I absolutely want to be in the water. I absolutely want to be catching waves, but I genuinely get as much happiness and letting somebody else Ride a wave [01:02:00] insert just going you get this one you get this one and particularly if it's one of my kids We go like no you go and and but even if it's not my kids Just seeing seeing the joy and also that sort of creating that nice environment whether it's at the sea or at the wave To be able to go actually let's just give a wave away, you know, let's not be let's not be selfish Let's actually Spread a different message of actually just being, you know, um, just being a bit more giving, just being a bit more caring and realizing.

[01:02:33] And again, there's huge, um, uh, uh, research around this, this oxytocin effect, where if you, if you do something, give, give, give something to somebody, you will receive the most incredible, um, uh, um, hits of positivity. And what even better is that the people who are watching you give something to somebody will get it [01:03:00] twice as much.

[01:03:00] And I love the fact like the, and I try and I don't do it. I don't do it in a, um, contrived way. But I love it when, you know, when I'm surfing at the wave where I go, no, you go ahead of me, you know, like two or three, like you go ahead, you can get more waves therefore, and then the effect then straight away of, of that whole group suddenly goes, Oh, like you're giving waves away.

[01:03:26] Yeah, well, maybe I'll do that, or maybe I'm not going to be so kind of like hurried to catch my own. Actually, let's, let's all relax and actually becomes a much, much happier environment. So this kind of oxytocin effect of watching other people get, get that joy that you know that you get is, yeah, is incredible.

[01:03:46] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: To quote, uh, Al Chapman from Surfers the movie. Give a Wave. Give a wave. This one you might know now know they might have a cute sister. You never know. So I mean, uh, [01:04:00] I got asked then like, how did you introduce your kids to surfing and do they. Like consistently, because I'm always, I'm always very curious about this, this question of like passing on surfing to the next generation or your younger, your kids, because. Not everyone does it successfully. Um, a lot of kids will rebel against whatever their parents do, no matter how cool it is.

[01:04:26] Um, they'll go the opposite way. And I'm curious, like, how do you, do your kids surf consistently? And, and if they do, like, how did you introduce them to surfing?

[01:04:36] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: Yeah, um, yeah, my kids, my kids do surf. Um, they're, yeah, they, they really, they really enjoy surfing. They enjoy surfing at the beach as much as they do at the wake. They find they, all three of them, um, feel, um, Without a doubt a bit of a pressure when they go to the way because they were thinking they would be [01:05:00] expected to be brilliant and Probably got access to waves whenever they want which they don't have access to waves whenever they want But I think that they felt a little bit of a pressure as to I'm the son of the person who made this place.

[01:05:16] I must be really really good And I think particularly, you know, if you look at, um, that, you know, the, the owners of wave garden, um, um, um, sons, you know, they are unbelievable, like one, one's, one's the best, best junior in the world. Uh, and the other one's about to go, um, uh, make a charge for the CT. Um, and they're amazing and, you know, but actually they learn most of their crafts in the ocean, not at the wave pool.

[01:05:44] So they're, they're, they're, they're funnily, they're. Um, quite worried about. Being seen as having a massive leg up because they'd, they got the wave pool. Well, the wave pool absolutely keeps you like good and [01:06:00] trained, um, in the flat, flat times, but actually, you know, you still to be a really good surfer, you've still got to do it in the ocean, but going back,

[01:06:09] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: the wave knowledge.

[01:06:10] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: yeah, exactly.

[01:06:12] But, um, going back to my kids, I think there was a bit of anxiety that they need to be good. Which definitely wasn't from me. I think that was their own, their own sort of innate feeling like they need to be really, really good. Um, my eldest, um, I probably did push too much too early with him. So keen to get him into something that I love.

[01:06:36] Um, and he, he didn't, definitely didn't rebel, but he just sort of, It just didn't, didn't quite take to it as, as, as much as other kids. And then I realized that that was, this was completely me trying, trying too hard. Um, and I, you know, I did it when they were playing rugby as well. You know, probably was more pushy.

[01:06:58] I'm not a pushy dad, but [01:07:00] more pushy than I needed to be. Uh, and so, yeah, you always, you always, um, You know, uh, you always make your biggest mistakes with your first kid. And then, um, what's good. So I just realized I just need to back off from it. Uh, if people want to come, so if my kids want to come surfing with me, then they can, but I'm not going to pressurize them anymore.

[01:07:21] And as soon as I stopped pressurizing them, they absolutely wanted to do it. And what we've now got is a really nice basis whereby. I'll go, I want to go to the, to the beach 99 percent of the time they say, yeah, can I come with you? I go to the wave and they'll want to know what the session I'm doing. And if it's not one of the big barreling sessions, then they'll want to come as well.

[01:07:43] So it's just a nice, it's just a nice, nice, uh, level that we've got now where the kids. Love it. They absolutely get it. Um, um, but, and of course they're immersed in the culture and, you know, they're, you know, they, they, they've [01:08:00] got access to incredible people who come and visit and, you know, some real superstars as well as, um, uh, they, they all three of them I've taken to the world adaptive games, um, um, and they've been helping out and volunteering to try and make sure that they've got real understanding of.

[01:08:18] of how surfing can really open up accessibility, um, to people who wouldn't normally have access to that. So I think they've also got a deeper understanding and knowledge of, of how important that is, is both as a therapy, but also the accessibility side of things. And without a doubt, some of their biggest heroes, which I'm most proud about is that their biggest heroes are probably, um, um, guys and girls in the adaptive community where they're gone.

[01:08:46] A, they rip, they're really, really good, but secondly, they have overcome the most incredible disadvantages to be able to do that. So I think they've got a real understanding of, of the privilege that they've got. Um, and balanced with, [01:09:00] yeah, having heroes that they can lean on anytime who've, who've, who've gone through way more hardship than hopefully my kids will ever go through.

[01:09:08] Um, so yeah, so that was a very long answer to, Something, but, but, but, but that's where it is. It's just sort of trying to make sure that they, they, they love their surfing, but equally they care about the heritage, but also how lucky they are to have the privilege of being able to go surfing almost whenever they want to, not quite.

[01:09:32] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: I see what I would do is just say no, no, no You're not allowed to surf only dad can surf and that would be the way that I would get my kids to get into surfing Like no, no, not for you. This is

[01:09:42] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: Yeah.

[01:09:43] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: thing. Make it tantalize him a little bit

[01:09:46] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: exactly.

[01:09:48] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: I'm I want to talk about the adaptive Surfing that because you're heavily involved with that and you know, and it's it's it's I think that's probably one of the best [01:10:00] things that has come out of the invention of all these wave pools are the, is the accessibility for a lot of people, particularly with disabilities.

[01:10:11] Um, you know, it's, it's, You're creating a really nice, safe space for them to do it on a consistent basis. Like, it just, it's easy to get into, whereas, you know, sometimes going to the ocean can be quite intimidating. Um, where did that relationship start? Was that something, when you started this project, right, we're going to get adaptive surfers in here?

[01:10:34] Or was that something that, that came along the way that you discovered, and you're like, Oh my God, this is so great for this. Yes. Mm

[01:10:41] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: Um, yeah, so I've always been very aware of the adaptive community or, or the disabled community, both through my work previously. Um, you know, my, um, equally my, my, my grandparents, they had, um, uh, [01:11:00] she was my I guess she's my great aunt, um, who had special needs, um, uh, cerebral palsy. And so I just always grew up around people who had various disability needs.

[01:11:16] Um, um, and I've never been scared, worried about, you know, even, even in the seventies, you know, when I was growing up or even in the eighties and probably still, um, nowadays is that there was, there was a real, um, you know, how do I talk to somebody who's got cerebral palsy or like, how do I strike up a conversation or like, I feel really clumsy around, um, you know, people who've got adaptive needs or disability needs.

[01:11:44] And I'd never had that, which, which is, which is mainly because, you know, I grew up around that with, with my, my, with my family. Um, but then, so therefore I've always had this idea that that shouldn't be a barrier for, for happiness [01:12:00] and being able to do stuff. Um, and so when we, started to devise this place and space.

[01:12:08] And then obviously the wave was the center of that is going, well, what we need to make sure is like, we need to bring as many people from all ages, all backgrounds and abilities together. For me, that was the real recipe of a successful community is making sure that it's a community that connects people who, who've, being disparate for, for, for various reasons, could be economic, cultural, whatever it might be.

[01:12:36] So, you know, who are those groups? Like, how can we reach out into those communities? We've got so much of those communities around the Bristol area, um, and it's a very multicultural place. Um, but going, well, it's not just culture, it's culture, religion, it's disabilities, like all of those aspects. How can we make sure that we're creating a space and place that's accessible for that?

[01:12:58] Um, and so [01:13:00] right at the beginning, I was talking to, um, um, Adam and Ian, who've, our architect firm, and said, look, the first thing we need to do is design the entire wave as if we were going to have, uh, like 30, 40, 50 wheelchaired, um, people or people who are blind or people who've got sort of hearing difficulties or, um, you know, various, various, um, disability, um, issues.

[01:13:26] How can we create a space and a place that caters for them all? Because if we can do that through the most I guess the most challenging eyes that we're going to, um, um, deliver customer service through them by inference, we should be able to take care of everybody else. So, um, yeah, lovely guy called Spike Kane, who's one of the like, um, uh, amazing, amazing person.

[01:13:49] You should definitely get him on the podcast. He's such an incredible person. Um, He's kind of like the grandfather of adaptive surfing, particularly in the, in the UK, but, but generally, [01:14:00] um, and yeah, sat down and he's, he's got a very good architectural eye anyway. And so he had just gave us that input and say, right, we're going to build a wave pool.

[01:14:10] How would you make that as adaptive friendly as possible? And that was, that was the basis upon which we designed the whole space and then led on non adaptive needs over and above that. And yeah, yeah. By and large, we've, we've done a good job. We could always do better, but you know, if we were able to make sure that it was accessible to people who really never have access to it in a proper way, um, then that would be amazing.

[01:14:40] And then secondly, People who come and visit us, um, it's amazing to see where they go, Oh, I can't, I can't go surfing. It's cold, or I can't go surfing because, you know, I've got a bit of a bad back or I can't go surfing cause I'm unfit. And then they suddenly see Martin Pollock, um, uh, paddle out there with only one [01:15:00] arm, um, and ride a barrel like going, I now don't have an excuse not to get in there now.

[01:15:08] Um, and so a little bit of it is. Like start firing your excuses as to why you can't do something cold. I kind of get to like, some people just don't like cold water and that's okay. But actually beyond that, there's no reason anybody couldn't be riding a wave, even if it's on your belly or with, with the phone, you know, with the body board or it doesn't matter what, just get in the water.

[01:15:33] Just have fun in the water. You will feel better afterwards. Um, and so, so there's like lots of different layers in it. It's like making sure that it's truly accessible for all ages, all backgrounds, all abilities, making sure we design a place, um, that will, will stand the test of time. And, and thirdly, making sure that people are inspired to try something that they wouldn't normally do by going, wow, if [01:16:00] those people can do it.

[01:16:01] I absolutely should be able to do it.

[01:16:06] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: I want to now ask, like, your father seemed to have had, obviously he's had a huge impact on you. Um, but he, uh, help to, from what I've read and listened to, like help to spark, you know, your, your drive for this wave pool, it seems. And I was, I was first like hoping you could talk a little bit about what type of man he was and who he was.

[01:16:31] And then that moment, you know, uh, when he inspired you to, to pursue this wave pool.

[01:16:39] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: Yeah. Um, it's quite simple. My dad, I guess it's just, it was always a very, very caring man. He just very, very caring, very funny. Um, really, really try hard to please people. Um, but is, uh, was, you know, honestly, a really lovely guy. Um, just fundamentally a good [01:17:00] human. Um, he, he was, I guess he inspired me along the way by just helping me try and be the person that I am.

[01:17:11] Um, you know, he's a very, very, he was a very, very good role model. Um, but he, he doesn't know, he never knew. Anything about the wave, the, the, the, the spark of interest on the wave was on his deathbed. Um, when I was literally saying goodbye to him and said that I made a promise that I would do something, I guess, in his honor, in some ways, pretty clearly something that would bring a whole lot of health and happiness to the greatest number of people.

[01:17:39] Cause I knew that that's what his driver was. Um, so. Ironically, he never, he never, he never knew what the wave is, doesn't know it existed. Uh, my mum constantly tells me that he would be super proud of me, um, which is always nice because I, he definitely would be. He would probably though, [01:18:00] ironically, be the person that would tell me not to do it.

[01:18:03] He would be the person he is He was always very risk averse. He would be up all night, probably worrying about me jacking in my job, having no income for six years, putting that stress on my family. Um, not really understanding or knowing how to do what we're wanting to do. Um, he would probably. and ironically be the person that would tell me not to do it.

[01:18:31] Um, so, and, and so there is that beautiful irony that through him passing and him, him dying actually created, uh, not a new lease of life, but allowed me to not listen to Um, not the doubters. I think he would have, he, he, he wouldn't have doubted I'd be able to do it, but he would be so worried he'd be asking me not to do it.

[01:18:57] Whereas my wonderful mum, classic [01:19:00] mum, you can do anything. Yeah, I'm gonna be proud of you. I don't care if you go to prison. Don't care if you become bankrupt. I'm going to be proud of you no matter what. Um, so, and, and so that's kind of, that's great because it gives you a sort of, uh, slightly misplaced optimism that you could do anything.

[01:19:19] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: Well, you got the balance between the two

[01:19:21] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: So, um, so, you know, whatever happens, my mum thinks I can do it and she's gonna be proud of me. Um, and my dad would have been there on my shoulder going, Nick, you shouldn't be doing this. You really shouldn't be doing this. I wouldn't be doing this. Why are you doing this? Um, so yeah, so he sort of, I guess, yeah, it was through his passing that the whole, the whole project really started to sort of gather some momentum.

[01:19:47] Um, and then that sort of irony of the fact that actually he, his inspiration came in that sort of preceding, I don't know, whatever it was, 42 years of, Of, [01:20:00] of, um, of bringing me up, um, to that point. And actually it's weird that in his passing that, that, that sparked, that was the spark, um, uh, that made me go, okay, I I'm only on this planet for a finite amount of time.

[01:20:18] How can I make it count? Um, and that's, yeah, that's, that was the spark really.

[01:20:25] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: I love that. Was there a moment where the idea came to you? Do you remember when it, when it came to the idea for the pool? Uh, yeah.

[01:20:37] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: very, very clearly I was in this room in fact, and, um, and was just on YouTube one day and it was the day that WaveGarden released their technology and said, Look what's coming. Um, and there was this sort of, um, cool, almost black and white grainy picture of waves suddenly rising out of a lake. Um, [01:21:00] this sort of black liner off the mist, um, is still, is still still online at the moment.

[01:21:06] Uh, and then going, oh, that looks so cool. And then that final clip of actually somebody riding the wave and that was just like, blew my mind. Uh, that was the bit of just going. Well, I now know what I'm going to be doing for the rest of my life. Like we have to make one of those in Bristol and put that whole, cause I probably had had a couple of months worth of thinking about how could develop sort of.

[01:21:35] That blue health agenda around a space and a place, um, that could impact people's health and wellbeing on a, on a scale. But then as soon as I saw that, I was like, that combines what I'm passionate about with. My other massive passion if I can splice those together. Um, yeah, that would be the dream

[01:21:57] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: Was, um, was it always in your [01:22:00] mind to be wave garden technology or did you explore other wave pool technologies as you, as you started the project?

[01:22:07] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: when we looked we looked at you know, I think, you know, we had to raise an incredible amount of money and so

[01:22:12] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: 26 million was that or pounds?

[01:22:16] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: million pounds. Um, so yeah with with literally had like 500 quid in my back pocket That was all I had so, um, um Yeah, so we had to, as part of the due diligence to be able to, um, raise the finance, uh, we had to explore every option and, and also understand what, what potentially is going to come, come in the future.

[01:22:41] Um, so, you know, obviously spoke to, um, Kelly Slater and his team, like trying to understand, you know, where they were at. I knew that they were. I've been working on that for a long time. Spoke to Surflock, a guy called Tom Lopterfeld, lovely guy, lovely team. Yeah, who, um, [01:23:00] who were, like, getting really, really close to it at that stage as well.

[01:23:04] Um, but, I guess, yeah, we had to, we had to take a punt at some stage. Like, everybody was very, very, at the early stage then. Um, and obviously WaveGuard had just released it, um, their technology and it was a working, working prototype technology. Um, and, and then, yeah, we just had to commit to, to something otherwise I could be waiting for four years, five years, six years.

[01:23:31] You just don't know when it might be. Um, and I just knew that giving, You know, if we're able to build, build out a scheme together, then actually that will help them raise more capital and improve their technology and it becomes a virtuous circle. So, um, yeah, I got left, I got left, um, 20, 000 pounds from, um, from my dad on, um, uh, from his estate.

[01:23:59] And I immediately [01:24:00] put that money straight into buying exclusivity for wave garden. Um, so it was a bit of a, it was a bit of a, um, for me, that was a lot, particularly at that time where, where like three young kids and yeah, it was, it was. It was a ballsy one, but, um, but my wife said, look, that, that is your money.

[01:24:19] Like this, this is, this is gifted to you from your dad. You've got to just do what you feel is right. She probably thought I needed to do a loft extension or something, but put it, put it into the wake on tech. And, you know, we were the first people to sign a, an exclusive deal with wave garden. And I think that that really, um, bonded us as, as companies to go, let's just make this happen.

[01:24:44] It's like, yeah, there's obviously contracts and all the rest of it, but ultimately it was, uh, it was a handshake over a glass of Rio Rio and said, let's make this happen. Um, and yeah, we managed to, I

[01:24:58] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: has that [01:25:00] relationship been, I guess, over the years? Like, how does that work? Um, like, do they go to you for a lot of feedback now? Are you almost consulting? Some of the other sites that are potentially being built, uh, and like, how is that, how much of the give and take is there between the two?

[01:25:16] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: think we've got, we've got really good relationships, um, with, with, with wave gone without a doubt, you know, we've, we've been through a lot and it's like, like any, you know, any decent relationship or marriages that, you know, there's always ups and downs and, you know, times when we've delivered, we've under delivered and they've under delivered and, and like, Like all things.

[01:25:37] And of course you can wrap stuff up around contracts and legals and all the rest of it. But ultimately it's around relationships and being able to look each other in the eyes and just making sure that we're going to, we're going to be good, aren't we? Like we're going to be fine. Um, and even the best, You know, even the most legally robust contracts, ultimately, it needs to be around a [01:26:00]handshake and just trusting.

[01:26:01] So I think that we, you know, particularly myself and Fernando and Hosuma, we've got, I think we've got a really good trusting relationship. Um, and I guess now many more projects are online now, um, and they're working on them. You know, they are, they have definitely gotten a really impressive pipeline of projects that are ahead of them.

[01:26:23] They've got other partners who've developed and, um, learned, um, stuff through, and actually we, we had a really good relationship, um, particularly at the beginning where they were. You know, they, they brought a lot of their staff over to us to try and understand what we're, how we're trying to get through the teething problems and all the rest of it.

[01:26:43] And it was interesting because back then there was a little bit of a sort of, Oh, we kind of want to keep a little bit to ourselves. We don't want to give like all of our sort of almost IP and secrets away. But equally, the reality is that we need [01:27:00] everybody to succeed in this industry. So you then start going, you know, why are we doing that?

[01:27:04] Because actually, if we know something that they don't know, and then they do. They advise somebody something bad, the other side of the world. That's only just going to reflect badly on us. So actually we all need to be successful, particularly in nascent industry, right at the start is that we need to all be successful.

[01:27:23] The worst thing for us is for two, three, four surf parks to start bombing because of, you know, financial risk or, um, health and safety risk or whatever it might be. So, you Anything we can do to make them successful and therefore make others at Surf Park successful, it's only got to be a good thing. So we don't, you know, it's a big old world out there.

[01:27:46] Like, we're, we're not, we're not looking for world domination and completely monopolize. We just need to all be successful together. And I think that once that, that dawned upon us, um, um, then everything is just [01:28:00] much, much easier, much, much easier.

[01:28:05] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: stressful was the process in, from, from starting to building the pool? Like, and how did you manage that stress?

[01:28:15] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: Um, , uh, try to surf

[01:28:20] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: Asking, asking for a friend, by the way, just, you know, in case I'm thinking of something. Nah, just

[01:28:25] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: Yeah, yeah. Um hmm. It, it, it, I guess in the early stages it felt like it, it felt like an unreachable dream and was probably riding on huge amount of optimism, naivety, um, self-belief. Um, and then, as you know, as. All the various bits of the puzzle started to drop into place and that reality of actually, we, we are actually going to build this.

[01:28:58] This is, this is incredible. [01:29:00] Um, uh, and that, that dawn of. Okay. This is going to be, we've now got people paying and they booked in. We we've got to deliver. Um, yeah, it, you know, I guess it's just a proper rollercoaster. I know it's, I know it's a bit of a, um, you know, it's a bit of a cliche, but it was a real rollercoaster that the highs were so high and the lows were so low.

[01:29:25] Um, and the reality, like everything was building up towards opening. And then the reality of. What I thought was the end was the absolute beginning of suddenly, um, the most stressful thing was, was opening. And it wasn't opening because obviously we had to make sure that it was a good experience and all the rest of it.

[01:29:51] It was suddenly realizing that it was the start. It was just the start. The, what I thought was going to be the end was the start. And, and it, [01:30:00] and suddenly everything else could be, we could control everything before that, before we open, we could control what we talked about, what we spoke about, what we believed in, um, like all our messaging, we could control.

[01:30:16] As soon as we were open, we were inviting, felt like we were inviting the world to come and have a look at something that we We didn't even know we hadn't even had the chance to enjoy ourselves yet. Uh, and it felt like I liken it a few times to, um, inviting the most critical person you can think of to come and have a look at your brand new house before you've even unpacked the boxes.

[01:30:43] It's like, yeah, like, can I just. Can you just at least give me two or three weeks

[01:30:50] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: get settled. Let me just get settled, you know.

[01:30:56] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: and suddenly realizing that, you know, we were starting to get some complaints, some, [01:31:00] some of the, some of the tech didn't quite work properly. And we, you know, we were just like learning so fast. Um, and then feeling like everything that's quite work out. Um, felt really personal. Um, it felt like it was, it was a, it was a smite on, on me personally.

[01:31:21] Like if, if, if, you know, somebody in customer service wasn't happy or the food wasn't quite right, or it was too cold or it was too warm or whatever it might be. It always felt personal and I think that that's that was the bit that I wasn't prepared for is that when you've got somebody who's just put their life and their personality into something is that I never had that chance to separate myself from what we've built.

[01:31:49] Um, and I, I wasn't ready for that at all. Um, and I found that really, really hard. Um, and then, and then I had, yeah, I, [01:32:00] uh, I had a massive stroke in 2020, 2020 in February, 2020, um, uh, lost all ability to speak and yeah, I was like properly feared for my life. Um, and then, and then we went straight into lockdown, um, which, you know, so just as we.

[01:32:20] Open this brand new business and our bookings were looking really good for that spring and summer. Um, yeah, we went into lockdown and, and just had to shut down. So, so the timing was like, just, just terrible. Um,

[01:32:33] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: you just Like, it must have felt like, oh shit, everything's falling apart. Like, oh god, we have COVID, what are we going to do to survive this? I have a stroke, I can't even communicate. Like, holy moly. And I think that also kind of brings up, though, then, this thing, this discussion that we had earlier about community.

[01:32:55] And the people you surround yourself with, and I imagine you have [01:33:00] built this great community around you and definitely in the process of building this, this pool. But I imagine that must have been such a incredible, I don't want to say relief, but you know, something that you could at least lean on during that time.

[01:33:17] And that must have been incredibly helpful.

[01:33:20] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: yeah, no, totally. Look, I, you know, again, going back to sort of talking about leadership, it's a, you know, it, it is around making sure that you, you know, you're surrounded by the smartest people, the people who can, who can help you when, you know, that, and I think that, that's, you know, That's a massive part of, of being a leader is making sure that you're kind of like the dumbest person in the room is you just got the people around you who in theory can make you a bit redundant.

[01:33:47] Um, you know, Craig, who was the CEO at that time, who'd been on that, on that path, particularly, um, through the investment process onwards and building the business. Um, you know, [01:34:00] Totally stepped up. Um, the team around the board, the investor, everybody, you know, we were in, we were in a new world, you know, we, we built something remarkable, something that nobody knew kind of, you know, it was, it was all new to everyone.

[01:34:15] Um, but equally, we'd, we'd poured literally had bought poured 30 million, 29 million worth of infrastructure into the ground. It can only be a wave pool. It couldn't be, I mean, you probably could drain it and it'd be a very, very expensive, um, skate park. But, um, but, but it was, it was the fact that we'd only just built it.

[01:34:40] So there was also a real enthusiasm to make it succeed and to be able to show that it was. It was the right punt, you know, for our investors to, to do. We hadn't, we hadn't been able to prove whether it worked or not. We hadn't even had a six months trading. So it was like, [01:35:00] there was, so there was huge amount of hope because we knew that the bookings were really, really good in, in the spring and summer.

[01:35:06] So we just knew like, if we can. If we can just stay alive, if we can just make sure that our staff are on furlough, make sure that we can pay, you know, our bills, all the rest of it, just keep the dream alive for when we get post COVID, then I think that we've got a real shot at this being a really great, great venture.

[01:35:25] Um, but of course, with me out of the picture. You know, luckily, you know, I had, um, Craig, the executive team, our investors, our board, they all stepped up and like, just did what they could do needed to do to be able to at least keep us fighting for another day. But equally, you know, that's what we all have to do in business, uh, you know, in the business world.

[01:35:47] And, and, and, And family life is like, what do we need to do to just keep afloat until we get past this weird stage? Um, and yeah, it was amazing that people stepped up and really, really helped. And, [01:36:00] um, and I guess, yeah, I guess having, if I was trying to reflect it back on me, it's just, I had my, one of my really good skillsets is bringing the right people around me.

[01:36:12] Um, I'm, I'm good at connecting, making trusted relationships with people and connecting to. People and being, being able to grow a really good team. Um, and that's what I did. And then, and, and that, that stood me in good stead when I was unwell, because they all stepped up and I just knew that they were, they're, they're really good people that would do the right thing.

[01:36:35] Um, so. Yeah, but it was, it was gnarly.

[01:36:39] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: how long was it till you could return to working the way, you know, working there, working at the pool, the wave, and then also surfing? How long was that recovery time?

[01:36:53] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: Yeah. So the, um, the recovery time started to get my speech back, um, a little bit, fairly [01:37:00] soon within a few weeks I could start to start to get some words together. Um, and it probably, It's probably took in total about nine months before I could cohesively talk, um, a bit longer to write. Um, and then the main thing from, from, from the stroke is, is processing complex things.

[01:37:20] So, um, like way back, you know, I've always been dyslexic and, and, um, but the, the stroke brought all my dyslexia back as well. So I had to relearn the, the, the things that I'd. I'd, I guess the tools that I used to overcome the dyslexia to like relearn those again. And so my, my thought processing was, was quite awry and you know, it's still, it's still not quite right now, but it's, it's absolutely good enough to be able to.

[01:37:52] talk to you and all the rest of it. Um, and then surfing was, was, was interesting. Um, the, [01:38:00] because we had to shut down the whole of the lake, um, in, you know, when we went into furlough and closed down the business. Um, obviously there's just a, whole load of stagnant stagnant water in the lake and we're trying to turn it over, but we couldn't, we didn't want to spend lots of money just turning waves over and chlorinating and UV treatment and stuff.

[01:38:21] So gradually the lake was starting to go a little bit greener. Um, And then I went to go and visit and it was quite, it was, it was amazing cause it was incredible, incredible summer. Um, that, that summer, um, the weather was scorching and it was beautiful, but the downside is that obviously that increases, um, the algae growth in the lake and also the trees were starting to die.

[01:38:45] The ones that we'd, we'd planted, it was like 16, 000 trees that we planted. So, um, so I, I, I, I took it upon myself because I couldn't really speak at that time is to try and start watering the trees a bit more and then start to [01:39:00] try and clean the lake. So I just got a couple of really long brushes and started to try and brush up the algae and then mix it in with a little bit of chlorine and filter it.

[01:39:08] Um, and, um, and I realized that. Being in and around the water every day. I was you know, I was just in board shorts But I was just just cleaning the lake every day. I was getting stronger. I was feeling like I was getting stronger I didn't need to talk to anyone because there's no one there to talk to so I didn't have that pressure of having to speak and there was something about being in the water that I felt like It was, was restorative.

[01:39:36] Well, it was, was making me feel better much quicker than I had been just sat at home. And, and, uh, and I just realized that every single day that I was going to the lake, um, I was just getting better and better and better. So I just, just continued to do that. So for, for months, I was just going down to like [01:40:00] cleaning, um, just making, making stuff good.

[01:40:03] Um, and was just realized that I was getting better and better and, and was a big part of my rehabilitation. And then I guess, Then realizing as we started to come out of the pandemic going, like, basically the whole world is almost had a stroke, like they've been, they've been, they've not been able to talk to each other, not being able to connect to each other, not being able to be outside and exercising and all those kind of things is actually, um, I know what it's like to feel completely locked away and not being able to communicate with people.

[01:40:39] And actually, as we were coming out of lockdown, people were hankering after wanting to get outside and get together and communicate and, and drink together and eat together and, and, and have fun together. And I think that that's, Weirdly, the Wave became, [01:41:00] particularly as it was deemed as a safe place to start exercising and all the rest of it.

[01:41:05] It was a really, really easy sell, um, to customers to say, Why don't you come and have a taste of what we've all been missing for the last year? Um, and, um, I think because of that, because there was such a pent up need and desire to have fun again, um, uh, and be outside and be connected. Um, that's why we had just this incredible boom of, um, sales that, that, that, that six months that we would then open and suddenly going, okay, this is something that, that the world needs is like, like literally this isn't something that surf, surfers need.

[01:41:47] Surfers will get their fix, but this is something that the world needs is just being. back together outdoors, you know, in, in beautiful space and having fun again. Um, [01:42:00] and I guess that then gave us the confidence to then go, okay, like now we understand this is, this is more than just a surfing leisure facility.

[01:42:09] This is something that is again, a panacea for people of all ages, all backgrounds abilities. It doesn't matter if you're, The best surfer in the world, or you're somebody who, who can't surf, can't even swim. There's a way in which we can, um, create a space for everyone. Um, and I think that that's, yeah, that, that gave us all the belief and our investors, the belief to go, yeah, this was, this was definitely one that was worth saving.

[01:42:37] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: I, um, I'm curious now, like how like competition is working in the wave pool. You know, you are involved with the English surf team. They, they use your facility to help train. And I'm curious, like, have you experimented with contests in there and have you tried different formats? Cause that. From a, you know, because we're all [01:43:00] sports fans, too, of surfing, I think, you know, just watch Bells the other day.

[01:43:04] It was freaking awesome. Uh, Cole Hauschman, that was awesome to see a rookie come up, but it's like, and I, and I'm like keeping an eye on Lucas Skinner, man, from the UK. Oh, fucking, I

[01:43:14] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: He's so good. So

[01:43:16] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: Oh my God. And his dad's the best, you know? Um,

[01:43:19] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: the pool today actually, right

[01:43:21] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: Oh, no way, you know, and I'm curious, like, one, have you experimented with competition in the pool?

[01:43:27] And two, have you thought about trying new formats in the pool for competition?

[01:43:34] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: Yeah. So we, we have, we've had a few competitions there. So we've done, um, the Rookie Rippers, uh, which was with O'Neill. We've done the Adaptive Surf competition there. We've done, um, the Interclubs, the Surf England do an Interclubs competition. So all the different clubs from around the UK come together and compete.

[01:43:55] Um, so we have done sort of two or three, um, Yeah, [01:44:00] decent events and they've been really successful, have been really, really successful. I think they then, they've tailored what they would normally do by the coast. To the lakes and naturally the contest organizers and the contest directors have worked out a format that works for their particular So particularly with the adaptives.

[01:44:19] It's a slightly different thing compared to the beach, but um, but have worked out a Format that really works. Well, I think we personally the wave could do There's something Still to do there. Uh, I think we could create some really cool formats. Um, We've got a few things. I don't I don't want to I don't want to

[01:44:42] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: Yeah. Yeah. No,

[01:44:43] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: Blow the surprise, but we've got some stuff.

[01:44:44] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: to blow it.

[01:44:45] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: Yeah, um later on this year that is and again, it's about obviously making sure that, um, the, the sort of professional surf contest scene is catered for, but actually what would a contest, [01:45:00] which is far more inclusive look like? Like, um, you know, there's, you know, say for instance, like belly boarding, like good old wooden boards.

[01:45:08] I think I've got one right there. Uh, yeah, just, you know, and like, how, how would that look like, and how can we, how can we encourage people who wouldn't necessarily normally. But compete in a fun, fun loving way. Um, so I think there's lots and lots of different things that we can, can go at. Um, and, uh, but, but knowing that, you know, we have, we do have some, you know, good partners who already are doing, uh, are, are doing really well.

[01:45:36] are including it a bit, a bit like the WSL did with, with Slater's, um, um, um, place, like try to incorporate it in their, in their natural program or regular program that they have. But I think that we can be more creative with time.

[01:45:53] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: Alright, I'm gonna throw ideas out at you.

[01:45:55] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: Go for it.

[01:45:55] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: is my chance. Alright. So, One is, I think you can do an endurance [01:46:00] surf competition, where it's a race. Where, because holy shit, like, I was exhausted. I mean, it definitely, not having salt in the water, I feel Feel in the paddling for sure. You know, I feel like I sink a little bit more.

[01:46:16] I'm not like cruising at top speed. And I think like you could totally do like a whole race competition, right. With it bit where, you know, you're paddling and someone's going to pass you to get the next wave and you see how many times people do a lap. I think that'd be a super cool endurance kind of competition that you could start.

[01:46:35] Uh, and he came, it can even start with running from the parking lot, even That's a, that's a long run. then like the other, I thought would be really fun is to do like a game of horse. I don't know if you're familiar with that, like in basketball, someone makes a shot and then you have to mimic that shot.

[01:46:55] And if you get it. Then you do a shot that's different, like over the head,

[01:46:59] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: okay.[01:47:00]

[01:47:00] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: with surfing. It'd be like, oh, I did an off the lip, you gotta do an off the lip, and now you gotta add something else, and they have to kind of copy that and see who does it better. You know? And that way, that's accessible to everyone, because it's friends competing against each other.

[01:47:15] Um, you know, I think there's, like, I, I also think, like, with, even with the professional stuff, we're not, like, The surf ranch contest is so boring to watch. I hate to say it, but it's just, you know, I would like to see it go maybe more figure skating route where they have to complete maybe certain maneuvers on the wave, um, or in the session, uh, you could do, or the other is, um, like surf battle, you know, where they have to like knock each other off the boards and, or, or man on man heat, kind of like boxing style where it's like, You know, they, they, they have to compete against each other.

[01:47:56] You add a little bit of the, the, the wrestling [01:48:00] theatrics to it. And then they, you know, and then it's like, okay, we're going to give you, there's a knockout move that you have that you could do, and it's like an air or a really good cutback and you're going to get judged on it. And the person who gets the higher score gets double the points or something.

[01:48:14] And you know, like make it. I feel like WavePool, there's so much you can explore with this, you

[01:48:21] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: Yeah. And it's, and for us, it's about sort of, yeah. Balancing that, um, like creating, curating amazing events that will, you know, will be great spectator sports as well as, you know, fun to compete on, but equally trying to balance that with. The day to day of, you know, of people coming and using it because, you know, we're really full and, and, and people still love coming just for a regular day.

[01:48:47] So it's like trying to balance those two together. But, um, yeah, always up for new, new, exciting ideas.

[01:48:54] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: Oh, and the last one is, you do the, the, you know, Mimica Pro Surfer Contest, where you [01:49:00] have all the surfers, maybe ride a similar board to like, let's say Aki, and they all have to try to do their best Aki interpretation on the wave. And, and then you have, you have someone judge that, or Aki even they're judging, and you're like, oh yeah.

[01:49:13] Yeah. Yeah. He's closest to my style. I'm finishing up here. Just a couple last questions. One is. When are you going to open a wave pool in London? Because my brother lives there and he does the drive to Bristol a lot, but he's like super keen for you guys to open there.

[01:49:37] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: So we, yeah, we, we've been, we've been sort of banging on that door for, for quite a while now, you know, without sort of, um, code and stuff, like put a bit of a spanner in the works for a while. But, you know, that that's a while ago now. And, and, and obviously market conditions conditions at the moment, like trying to raise prices.

[01:49:55] Big amounts of capital is very expensive at the moment, so we can raise, we can raise the money, but it just [01:50:00] comes at a really big cost. So just waiting for the market to just chill out a bit before we raise, um, uh, that money is important to us. Um, but equally, um, particularly in London, you know, London without a doubt would be a jewel in the crown to, um, to deliver one least.

[01:50:17] Um, you know, maybe two, um, surf parks there, um, more waves there. Um, but it does get wrapped up in an extra layer of bureaucracy and without doubt, that's, that's the bit that we're, we've been struggling with, but you know, any, Anything that's worth fighting for and wanting to do is worth, you know, quite often you have to overcome some big challenges.

[01:50:41] We managed to build the one in Bristol and it was in greenbelt land, which is like really hard to get planning permission to do. But we overcame, um, you know, overcame that particular piece of bureaucracy that we had to deal with. That potentially could have stopped us. And so it's not that we [01:51:00] were arrogant enough to think that we can, we can go anywhere and do anything, but there is always a process around it.

[01:51:06] And a lot of those kinds of processes, you, you, you can't shortcut. It doesn't matter. You know, we know, we know from all around the world that people who have got the deepest pockets ever, um, cannot build a wave pool because that particular area they're wanting to do it, they can't get permissions or there's, there's some kind of geological thing that doesn't work.

[01:51:28] So, um, money, money can't buy you anything and it doesn't, definitely doesn't speed the process up necessarily. Um, those balances and checks. there for a reason. That's to make sure that we build the right thing in the right way in the right places. Um, and so, yeah, it's taking more time than what we would hope for, but I'm really, really confident that we'll overcome those, those challenges.

[01:51:51] Um, I don't know when, um, but we're, we're actively working on them still at the moment. So yeah, we're not, we're not giving up on it at all. [01:52:00] Um, it just takes longer than we would think. And it's always much longer

[01:52:03] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: Always though.

[01:52:04] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: yeah, much longer than a surfer based in London would, would, would hope for. Um, if there was one in London and I was living in Bristol, I'd be like, ah, um, I want to go there.

[01:52:17] So

[01:52:18] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: When I lived there, I was like, I would go down to the Thames and try to see when like barges would come by. I'd be like, Oh, is this surfable? Is that surfable? And it's funny. Cause I love how you post sometimes these imaginative. Um, you know, uh, taking existing bodies of water and turn them into like what a wave pool would look like, like you did for Paris, you know, in April fools was great, you know, and like, I always, I always think about like how we could terraform, like sort of like existing body water, bodies of water into surf spots as well.

[01:52:53] Like, that's always a thing on my mind. Like, how do you build a tech that can be somewhat mobile and put it [01:53:00] in a place like the Thames or whatever? Although the walker into Thames might be a little nasty, I'm not sure. Heh heh.

[01:53:07] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: but yeah, there is, you know, there's so much water around the place naturally we could, yeah, it's about reinventing how we use that water because, you know, obviously a lot of it is around pollution because a lot of, you know, You know, a lot of water bodies that we have access to. You can't get in the water.

[01:53:25] You know, Bristol, Bristol Docks is a great example where we've got right in the center of the city, beautiful, you know, Dockland area. Um, but you just can't, you know, you can't get in it. You'll get so, so sick and you're going, well, you've got this beautiful body of blue health. Ready to go.

[01:53:45] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: Yeah.

[01:53:46] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: How, how can we change that?

[01:53:48] And obviously that's water companies and, and, you know, old Victorian drainage systems and all the rest of it, but there is a lot we could be doing, which actually, you know, again, [01:54:00]instead of queuing up to try and get an appointment with your GP, you could actually just be sat next to a really lovely water body and actually feel better.

[01:54:11] Instantly by doing that rather than waiting to get a prescription for some, some medication that, that, you know, um, artificially we'll, we'll do that for you. So yeah, it's just like how we can, how we can create spaces and places, either existing water bodies, but equally when we're designing new, new communities, new, um, housing developments, how can we make sure that that is actually, integral as part of those new developments that are coming about.

[01:54:41] Um, it doesn't, it doesn't, you know, you don't have to be a rocket scientist to know that actually, if you create an amazing, healthy space for people to live in, particularly new housing developments, then, um, then they will benefit from it both health wise, but also Even the developer will [01:55:00] probably get, you know, more money if money is their, you know, their, their driver, it's going to be a more attractive place to live.

[01:55:07] Um, so, yeah, I think that there's, there's something in there as well around, uh, existing bodies of water and how we can utilize them, but then also making sure that we're designing it into new developments, both housing developments, industrial development, whatever it might be, utilizing the water that we can capture.

[01:55:26] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: Now, my final question is, is, comes from my brother, who wanted me to ask you this. He's like, why are there no video cameras streaming my session? He's like, I want, he's like, we, when we went, he had to like, set his phone up on the thing to get our video, you know, like, he's like, where's the surf line cams for that?

[01:55:46] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: Yeah. Yeah, that's true. Um, all I can say is watch the space.

[01:55:51] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: Yeah. All

[01:55:52] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: Yeah. Yeah. It's something that we are, you know, we've known for ages, uh, is a [01:56:00] good opportunity, um, for everyone. And it's something that we're looking into right now.

[01:56:05] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: I will pay for it too. Like we were, we were, we were like, yeah, I'd pay for it. Money and your photographers are great by the way. They are wonderful. Awesome. By the way.

[01:56:15] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: Yeah. I mean, I guess the thing that's slowed us from, Pressing the button on it is particularly around the AI stuff because yeah, you know, there's two or three technologists now that do really good Videography where you can properly you know match the surfer to the video and all the rest of it and it's come a a time where we were wanting to do video anyway, but actually the speed at which the AI side of it is, is accelerating.

[01:56:46] And because there's like two or three players out there, it's, it's taken some time to work out which is going to be best and, and suitable for our needs and stuff. Because then, you know, the ability to, To be served up, you know, video, [01:57:00] um, of your session, you know, goes straight to your mobile phone or onto your inbox to see and be able to study the way that you, it's, it's going to be, it's mind blowing.

[01:57:10] But of course, yeah, there's, there's now two or three providers. It's making sure that we're, we're pressing the button on the right one.

[01:57:17] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: Oh my god, and then you're gonna be able to just be like, oh and if you want We can give you advice from a pro surfer and then the video gets sent to them and they're gonna analyze it Oh my god, like you're gonna You're gonna be able to provide like retirement jobs for, for former pro surfers, basically. That's, that's their career path, you know?

[01:57:40] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: But I think, I think, I think all, all, all surf pools will, will eventually have them. It's just, it's just a no brainer. That's the beauty of it is, you know, the frequency of the waves and the quality of the waves, but then the ability to, to actually see it and be able to, you know, adjust your technique and what have you.

[01:57:59] [01:58:00] So yeah, it's a no brainer without a doubt.

[01:58:02] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: I imagine though, a lot of that, that Oxytocin, those highs that you feel from surfing after you see yourself surfing might be a little depressing, but we'll see.

[01:58:12] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

[01:58:15] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: You mean I don't surf like Kelly Slater? Gosh.

[01:58:19] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: Yeah, hopefully you could AI manipulate it so that your app is amazing. It's like, I'm way better than I thought.

[01:58:27] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: Yeah, what you do is you offer like a pro surfer filter on

[01:58:30] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: Yeah, exactly. Yeah, exactly.

[01:58:33] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: Smooth out your turns a little bit, make sure your arm's in better place, you know. Ah, this surfing is digitally enhanced surfing. That's not real. There'll be a whole argument. It'll be great. Nick, I, I, I, Can't tell you how grateful I am for you spending this time with me.

[01:58:55] I, you know, really, again, like admire you look up to everything that you've been [01:59:00] doing and your, your attitude and your enthusiasm, you know, even though I didn't know you before, but on social media is just infectious and if anything to me, that. That spreads the positivity wave around the world. And I think it's really, uh, important and, uh, it's really appreciated.

[01:59:19] I'm really glad, uh, you were able to come on the show and let me indulge in all my fun questions.

[01:59:26] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: Yeah, they're really good questions and yeah, just thank you for inviting me into it and yeah, ultimately it's just about creating, you know, happiness and stoke and trying to spread it as, as, as wide and far as possible. Um, they say just only got one life and we just got to make sure we make the most of it.

[01:59:42] And then the really good stuff around it. We just need to spread that joy and surfing is just such. An incredible vehicle to send that sort of joy and care and love. And yes, it's just, let's just do more of it. And you know, it does that as well. So yeah, like we're, we're all [02:00:00] in it together without a doubt.

[02:00:01] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: Um, where can my listeners, many of them who are in New York or in the States, if they wanted to or were happened to be traveling the uk, where could they find the wave? And you and all your information

[02:00:12] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: Yeah. Just,

[02:00:13] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio:shameless plug,

[02:00:15] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: Yeah. Um, um, the wave. com, uh, is where you'd be able to, that's our, socials are, are the wave, um, myself I'm a wave maker, Nick, and I'm on socials and stuff. So, um, always, yeah. If ever you want to reach out and talk to me, then, uh, I'm, I'm always accessible there for, for chats and, um, yeah, and, and yeah, always be welcome.

[02:00:40] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: uh, uh, Nick, thank you so much. And man, I, I, again, listeners, like, I gotta say like I had such a blast at the wave and I was exhausted too. Like, you get your wave full. Like I honestly Nick like. When they were like, Oh, you got three more waves. I was like, no, I can't do [02:01:00] anymore. Even, you know, like I'm so tired.

[02:01:02] Like it was like, you know, it was like someone like you, you know, you're going into a bowl of cookie dough and you're like, I got to finish the last few bites, even though I'm full and I'm going to vomit, you know,

[02:01:12] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: so true.

[02:01:14] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio: It's, it's literally one of my favorite experiences, uh, you know, and I, I really, uh, recommend all of our listeners to go check it out and, uh, go check out Nick's, uh, social as well.

[02:01:26] It's just a ray of positivity and just, uh, whenever he posts, it's always a really nice, nice thing. So go follow him and, uh, yeah, Nick, really appreciate it. Thank you so much for coming on.

[02:01:40] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--guest427748--nick: Yeah, yeah, take care and yeah, just come back soon. Come and we'll get some ways together.

[02:01:45] 2024-04-04--t12-09-08pm--61fc20480e72b000787c6240--swellseasonsurfradio:Definitely. [02:02:00] [02:03:00]