Feeling For Light with James Katsipis

[00:00:00] Scarlett 2i2 USB: Hello and welcome to the swell season surf podcast. I'm your host Tyler Brewer. James This is a Montauk born artist known for his exceptional ocean photography and stunning visual art. Over two decades ago, could cheapest began traveling around the world, shooting and exploring distant shores as an adventure and surf photographer.

[00:00:28] Scarlett 2i2 USB-1: Growing up in and around the ocean is the natural theme and influence throughout his portfolio. Today as a fine art photographer, an in-demand commissionable artist, James, his work is featured in fine art galleries, campaigns, books, and magazines worldwide. He has recently opened his own gallery in Montauk.

[00:00:51] And it's absolutely beautiful. I've known James for some time and I've enjoyed watching him evolve and grow as a [00:01:00] person over the years, he's really come into his own and has had to overcome some large obstacles on his way. He's humble. Smart. Emotionally where, and one of my favorite interviews, I was recently in Montauk the week he opened his gallery. What follows is a really in-depth conversation with someone who has made many strides to get where he is. And now feels comfortable in his own skin. Our conversation wanders from his evolving attitude over the recent popularity of his hometown. To his technique. And of course his sobriety. I'm really stoked to present to you.

[00:01:40] My conversation with James, I think you all are really going to enjoy it. So sit back, relax, and we'll see you on the other side. Enjoy.

[00:01:51] Tyler: Yeah. Ah, there we go. Much better. All right. So we got it. We got a little ham and eggs we have two people. Yeah, we got a little ham and eggs coming at you here now. A [00:02:00]little ham and eggs. A little bacon,

[00:02:00] James: egg, and cheese. Nothing more Long Island than a bacon, egg, and cheese. That's our mascot.

[00:02:06] Tyler: Bacon, egg, and cheese.

[00:02:06] Or a sausage, egg, and cheese, you know. Whatever you prefer. I'm impartial. Although I do enjoy, you know, the Hamptons Co. They're, they're vegan. Egg sandwiches are quite good. Oh,

[00:02:16] James: someone, they gave me one of those by accident. And I turned around and I returned it immediately. And they go, Oh, you can have that though.

[00:02:22] Cause it's like, I don't want this.

[00:02:24] Tyler: That's your ultra processed, uh, fake sausage.

[00:02:28] James: Give me my heart attack. I paid for it.

[00:02:33] Tyler: So getting back to, um, your, like one of your first shows. Um, and we were talking about negative. It's called cherish, cherish, cherish. Why, what was behind the name on that?

[00:02:45] James: No, I was like 22 years old.

[00:02:49] Tyler: It sounds good.

[00:02:51] James: You know what? No, I think it was, it was about mom talk. It was about my town. Cherish. You know, cause I just cherished my town so much of Montauk, you know, where I live. And I [00:03:00] mean, that's what the show is about. You know, it was, it was all about people. I know surfers, places that I love to hang out, you know, and that's why I named it Josh.

[00:03:10] Tyler: Cherish the love we have. Was that like playing in the background?

[00:03:16] James: No, actually Dalton Portales, I had a band. Cause I like to throw parties at all my show openings, you know. Like, I go to a lot of art shows and I like the cheese and wine scene. Like, in the city, that's fine. But when Montauk, I like, you know, like, I want like a keg.

[00:03:32] And I want like, you know, some tequila. Not for me, I don't drink anyway. But like, I want every now like a good, fun time.

[00:03:40] Tyler: It's interesting. Like I always. I always, you know, like I, when I was younger, I used to go to all those cheese and wine art gallery openings and they were fun, but it was the ones that felt punk that always stood out like the Lisa Spellman style ones from the 80s.

[00:03:55] I love Lisa so much. I always, I always fantasize about like that type of [00:04:00] freaking art show, you know? Where people are like kind of raging and engaging with the art, too.

[00:04:06] James: She's so cool. I talk to Lisa every day. Like, we text with each other. She's so fun. And, uh, um, when I was opening it up, she's like, James, can I come work for you?

[00:04:17] I was like, yes! I was like, please. I was like, you're hired. No, I was like, but Lisa, like, how funny would it be if, like, you were in here just sitting and, like, people walk in and they see you sitting in here? They're like, wait, what? What's going on? It'd be so weird, like bizarro land. Well,

[00:04:35] Tyler: I gotta, so I want to ask this, like, this is really interesting because you, you grew up here in Montauk.

[00:04:42] You're, you're fiercely, you know, like protective of the place too, right? But

[00:04:47] James: I've, I've calmed down. No, no, no. It's been an

[00:04:50] Tyler: evolution. It's been an, it's been a really interesting evolution. I used

[00:04:53] James: to be pretty aggro, but now I've mellowed out. Tenfold, you know,

[00:04:57] Tyler: but it's interesting right like [00:05:00] you you have like being out here is Incredible because you have all these incredible resources out here.

[00:05:08] You have you had used to have Peter Beard, you know, and you know, I mean there's such a artistic legacy here and You know, you're able, if you grow up out here, you're able to make those networks and connections.

[00:05:23] James: Yeah, so one of the biggest, um, connections I had and, you know, I didn't realize until I got a little older.

[00:05:29] Like, you know, it's so funny, you just like hang out with all these people, you don't even realize like who they are. Totally. You get a little older, like, oh, okay. You're like, that guy's like world renowned artist. But, you know, I just like, Have coffee with him on the bench at ditch every day. Like, oh, so that's Julian Schnabel.

[00:05:45] I get it. All right. That's

[00:05:47] Tyler: why he's wearing a robe. Yeah. That's why he's

[00:05:49] James: allowed to wear pajamas at Salivar's at three. You know, like I get it now. All right. Cause he can do whatever he wants.

[00:05:55] Tyler: Well, it's, it's, it's funny. Like I remember when I was a Grom and I remember coming [00:06:00] out here, uh, sleeping in my truck for like a hurricane swell and connected with someone.

[00:06:06] He let me crash at his place. And then next morning he's like, Hey. A friend of mine is doing a, a, a clam bake, uh, he needs help. Do you want to do that? I'm like, sure. Next thing you know, we're at Richard Avedon's and he goes, hi, I'm Dick. And I'm like, hi, I'm Tyler. I had no clue who he was at 17, you know, Dick, Dick Avedon.

[00:06:24] He's like, I'm Dick Avedon. You know what I mean? He's like, call me Dick. I'm like, sure, Dick. And then I go surfing right out front, like not thinking. And it wasn't until years later where I'm like. Holy shit. I was hanging with Dick Cavett.

[00:06:39] James: I mean, you call it, I've never even referred to him as Dick. I know it's amazing, but this is, but like, this is like, like we, I mixed up the dicks in the town cause I'm like, Oh, Dick Cavett, cause we go surfing in front of his house as well, you know, it's like Cavett's go, Oh, okay.

[00:06:56] But I got my celebrities mixed up, like our [00:07:00] problem out here, but

[00:07:01] Tyler: I think that's what's cool. Uh, about where we live, too, because it's not just It's a low key

[00:07:06] James: vibe with all those people, you know? Like, and that's why they love it out here so much, because, like, we don't, like, fangirl them at all. And we just chill, and they're just normal people, and they can just be normal people.

[00:07:16] And, like, yeah, you see them, you're like, Oh, that's cool. That's, you know, so and so. Yeah. You know, and, but we don't bother them or anything like that. And we just let them get on with their life. And they're just part of the community. Yeah. They go to fundraisers just like us, you know, and they,

[00:07:30] Tyler: they, they got to go grocery shopping, just like us.

[00:07:33] They, they, they put their pants on one leg at a time. That's right. I don't know how you do two at a time. Who does that? Come on. What kind of weirdo? I mean, but it is like, I, that's why I always loved about New York surfing in general is you could be surfing. Next to someone you don't know if they're a plumber or a director or finance bro or whatever, you know It's like

[00:07:55] James: well chances are they're a finance bro these days [00:08:00]

[00:08:00] Tyler: But I want to talk about that evolution you've had about being protective of the place and and I was I was hoping we could kind of explore like what you used to feel As opposed to how you feel now in that evolution and if you can kind Give our listeners like a little bit of context too.

[00:08:17] James: Sure. And you know, like, yeah, I used to be like the grumpy local and That's fair to label me like that, but I'm not like that at all. So, you know growing up out here It's just us like, you know When we walk around here, like we feel like we're in our living room, you know Cuz I'm born and raised here. I grew up here spent my whole life here I know everybody here and these are all like my family.

[00:08:39] Yeah, and like when like Yeah, so here's an analogy for you Say you're at home.

[00:08:45] Tyler: Yeah

[00:08:46] James: You're in your living room in your house. You're in your favorite seat. You have your favorite snack your favorite beer You're watching your favorite show.

[00:08:54] Tyler: Yeah,

[00:08:54] James: everything's peaceful. You're just Cruising your love in life and all of a sudden the door [00:09:00] fucking gets kicked open 20 people come in they start rearranging your house.

[00:09:05] You know, they're like, oh this this couch is Ugly, we got to get rid of it. We got to make it better. But that's your favorite couch. That's got your ass imprinted It's comfortable. You like it and like no this won't do get rid of it. And now you're in some uncomfortable couch You got 20 people standing in your living room You can't even see the show you were watching before and they're calling you and then they turn around look you go Why are you so angry?

[00:09:29] Tyler: You know, like that's how

[00:09:31] James: that felt, you know, like they go, Oh, you're just an angry local. Well, yeah, I'm angry. Like you just came in swap, swept the rug up from underneath my feet. Everything that I knew and loved and for your own benefit, selfishly, you know, and then turn around and go, look at you, right?

[00:09:49] You're so angry, you know? Like, and that's how people live with me. I'm just like, well, you guys just don't understand maybe why we're angry. Yeah, it wasn't just me. It was like all of us.

[00:09:59] Tyler: Yeah,

[00:09:59] James: you [00:10:00] know, you know, and like, and that's why that was happening. But The dust settles and then you're like,

[00:10:06] Tyler: I kind of like what you did

[00:10:08] James: with the place.

[00:10:10] Tyler: You've just described my relationship with my wife.

[00:10:15] James: She kicked out the pig. I used to live with a pig. She kicked out the pig. She goes, no, Mako's gone. We're building a house. He's fine. I didn't like that at first, but he's even better than ever now. You know, we got white walls, beautiful art, nice couch, you know, it's looking good.

[00:10:31] You're like, you actually got a good eye for this. Yeah. You know, and there is some really cool stuff that the, the new people have brought to the town, but there's some pretty kooky stuff too, you know, but you know, it's kind of. Everyone's kind of worked it out, you know, everyone like at first, like even me and someone like the new guys, we were just like budding heads, even in the water and stuff.

[00:10:54] And now we're like besties, you know, it's like, we're like good friends. And like, it was so [00:11:00] cool because I met more interesting people now, you know, like I can't do it with like my network got even bigger, you know? And like, and I'm grateful for that now, but at the time, Yes. I, I was, I was upset.

[00:11:13] Tyler: Well, change is hard.

[00:11:15] And um, you know, it's, and this

[00:11:17] James: is like 2011. Yeah. Yeah. 2006. You know, it's like Surf Lodge showed up Totally. The new breed of Parters came out here with all the money and the Lambos and all that stuff. Yeah. And I was like, oh, that's. That's kooky, you know, and, but there's a place for that. And guess what? I don't have to go there.

[00:11:38] I don't have to be, it's big enough. I know where to hide now. And no, I have great spots, you know, and like people would wish they had my spot. But I know this land so well, I, if I need to get away, if I need to hide from the cops, no one's finding me, you know, I know how to get the hell out of

[00:11:56] Tyler: here. So, you know, the, the sub level to the bunkers.

[00:11:58] Oh, I've been in there. You [00:12:00] want to talk about that? You want to talk about

[00:12:02] James: Camp Hero? You want to go there?

[00:12:03] Tyler: We can, we can go full X Files with that too, with, uh, you know, the Montauk project. I'll go full Mulder on you right now. You know, I mean, I'm like, I remember being hit. Listen, there's a little bit of a.

[00:12:14] You know, offshoot here. But when I was in high school, my teacher handed me the Montauk project book. Oh my God. I remember reading that and being like, what the fuck? Like talking about time travel and mind control experiments and a beast that's in there, like it's some crazy ass. So

[00:12:34] James: when we were a little, we used to sneak in there all the time, and it was still operational, quote, unquote,

[00:12:40] Tyler: fully operational.

[00:12:42] James: And they used to have these Doverman pinchers in there that were just loose, like security dogs. And we'd go in there with our skateboards, jump the fence, and sneak in all over there. And all of a sudden, like, they'd be like, release the hounds. And, like, we'd be, like, hauling dogs. Ass like to get out of there.

[00:12:56] Cause these dogs are so scary and have to jump the fence to get [00:13:00] out. But like, we used to party in there. Like, so my buddy Cliff, his dad used to be the security guard. And so when Cliff's dad was away, Cliff knew, and we'd throw rave parties inside the project. And we'd be like, you know, There'd be like some party favors going around, maybe some psychedelics.

[00:13:18] Why don't they do that now in that space? Well, now it's a park. How

[00:13:24] Tyler: sick would it be

[00:13:25] James: to throw a concert there? It's so weird for me to go in there. Well, I don't know if you want to throw anything in there, because like Lyme disease just lives there, like you don't want to hang out. When I see people like sitting in the grass and stuff, like having their picnics, I'm like, Oh, well, I'm like, hello, arthritis.

[00:13:43] Hope you like that sandwich.

[00:13:45] Tyler: But, uh, getting back to, um, You know, that sphere of, of, of, of the people you've, you've grown that network, right? We're like,

[00:13:54] James: can't get off that. I was a grumpy local for, no, no, no, because

[00:13:58] Tyler: this is, no, this is [00:14:00] like an important lesson to people. I think, you know, cause I, I felt that too.

[00:14:05] I think it's also a surfer

[00:14:06] James: thing too. I think that's kind of, it's kind of worldwide, like territorial localism. And, and, and can I just say one thing? That was sort of taught to us growing up out here. Like, like surfing terrace growing up. We had some like hardcore older guys that taught us, you know, like, and they're like, if they don't live here, they don't serve here.

[00:14:28] And we watched it. We watched guys getting dragged out of the water and sent home crying, you know, and you're like, Oh, this is just like a normal day of terrorists, you know, like, I'm not going to name names because everyone already knows, but like, you know, we see guys getting beat up on the beach and, you know, sent packing their car and like we had some visitors, you know, back then and they're still around to this day, but, and you know, they claim to be around here all the whole time, but they were at ditch.

[00:14:52] Yeah. Ditch was different.

[00:14:53] Tyler: Yeah.

[00:14:54] James: You know, like we sent people to ditch. If you want to surf, you go to ditch.

[00:14:57] Tyler: It's the Malibu, you know, like everyone can go [00:15:00] there.

[00:15:00] James: Yeah, exactly. It's like, you want to surf, you go to ditch. There's no long boards allowed at Terrace. You know, there was one guy. Rodeo Gallop, who he lived right there and he was the coolest and he's a legend in Montauk and he wrote a mid length because he was a little older too, but like Respect the shit out of rodeo, you know rodeo's rights shout out

[00:15:19] Tyler: But that's like, you know, it's it's interesting because everyone like I see this I feel this too like this the change is really overwhelming sometimes and and the the newness it takes a little bit to get used to and But what it brings is, is incredible opportunities.

[00:15:39] My question then is like, how do you balance, um, those new opportunities without fully exploiting? And that's like a thing that I, I always struggle with too.

[00:15:50] James: No, you know what? I'm all over that. I'm trying to balance, you know, like, I'm trying to also pay my bills. Yeah. You know, I have rent. I got two, three rents now.

[00:15:59] Yeah. Okay. [00:16:00] You know, and staff. Yeah. Five. I can't be like, Oh, well, I can't sell this because it might, you know, upset the locals over here. No, that's kind of long gone for me. And like, I'm sure there's grumbles about what I'm doing over here. Cause I live in the smallest town in America. So like anything I ever do.

[00:16:20] Tyler, like I get shit for it. So like, I don't even care anymore. I just do, like, I just do me and I just stay happy and just, just want to keep taking photos and producing art. And that's it, you know, and it's like, and if some people are upset, sorry.

[00:16:35] Tyler: Well,

[00:16:36] James: but it's,

[00:16:36] Tyler: it feels like a lot of the, a lot of people who, who grew up here have, have taken advantage of that.

[00:16:43] And it's not a, I'm not, this is not a critique either. Like that, like, there's no. I don't think there's any shame in trying to utilize the resources you have at your disposal and the opportunities you have. Um, like it, but it, there is always [00:17:00] like a thing sometimes where you're like, is this okay or not?

[00:17:03] Okay. I always question in my head sometimes.

[00:17:05] James: Yeah. Okay. So it does linger. Yeah, absolutely. That question always lingers in the back of my head. No, like when I'm doing stuff, I'm like, Oh, you know, what about this photo? Like, If I post this photo are the boys going to be like, oh, you

[00:17:18] Tyler: know,

[00:17:19] James: of course they are.

[00:17:20] Yeah. You know, but like the question is not if they're going to be upset. The question is now is like, do I want to take that much shit right now? Do I have time for this right now? I'm like, But

[00:17:33] Tyler: it's funny because you probably are able to give shit back to each other because everyone is like everyone is benefiting from that You know, everyone This my buddy Tony

[00:17:41] James: Moore told me one day I was having a rough day just going through this exact thing and he goes You know what?

[00:17:50] Those guys don't know what they're talking about because the you know, the as well as you do. They do, you know? Yeah. And he said the rising tide lifts all boats. [00:18:00] Exactly. You know, and he's just like, keep doing you. And you know, they're gonna figure it out. And, you know, if I do well then that guy does well.

[00:18:06] Mm-Hmm. . And then that guy does that, you know? Well, and, and that's how I feel even with other photographers out here. 'cause you know, he can be like, competitive, but I'm like, no. And I send my buddies so much business Yeah. Like in the dms and stuff, like, 'cause I can't handle it all. Exactly. You know, and like, I, I just try to.

[00:18:23] I want everyone to do well, you know, that's kind of at the end of the day. I hope everyone's just Happy, you know,

[00:18:30] Tyler: do you do you? Um Like, I guess then like it's, it's, when was that shift for you when you, you realized I need to change how I perceive this and it was a gradual or was there a moment where you're like, I

[00:18:45] James: had a blowout with a buddy of mine and uh, well, he, you know, he moved out here, long border, I'm not gonna say his name, but I love him dearly now and we got into a fight in the water.

[00:18:58] Like screaming at each [00:19:00] other and we got on the beach and like, we were about to like go at it and we didn't. And then he said something to me, harsh, but totally needed it. And I was like, Jesus, what are you doing, man? Like, what, what are you going to, you're going to fight the world out here? Is that what you're going to do?

[00:19:18] You're going to fight everyone. And I'm like, you need to like chill out or I'm going to like stroke out. You know, I'm like, mom talks changing and you need to figure it out. Like, what are you going to do? Because you're not going to stop it. Yeah, it's impossible. Like, you're not going to stop it. So what are you going to do?

[00:19:32] So I chilled out, you know, and I was like, let me try talking to these new people. You know, let me see what they're all about really. Yeah. And I started talking and I'm like, everyone's pretty nice, right? You know, like, yeah, they drive a Range Rover, but they're like, They're like really nice and they're supportive and like, you know, like they just want to be out here and enjoy what you enjoy, you know, and it's like, it's not mine.

[00:19:58] It's not any of ours to like keep, [00:20:00] but you know what, as long as they come out here and just like respect it and don't like trash it, then everyone is like, it could be cool,

[00:20:08] Tyler: you know? And they were always growing pains with that, the change too. Like, I remember. You know, there was an uproar when shit was left on the beach after a party or whatever, you know It's like but those are lessons that everyone learns.

[00:20:23] James: Yeah. Oh, yeah. Well, there was a couple instances with like a couple new guys Whatever a couple guys came out and they were like, uh Had a huge party on one of the beaches and we got up the next morning. There was like a table and Wine bottles everywhere magnum champagne bottles a whole pig left on the beach and I Kind of lost it and I put him on blast and then they apologized Not only did they clean the beach they went around Town for like a whole month or like the whole summer and picked up trash all over.

[00:20:57] Wow. Yeah, it was really cool [00:21:00]

[00:21:00] Tyler: You know, and that's like and that's the thing. I think people sometimes Yeah, we're all human. We make mistakes. We do stupid things.

[00:21:08] James: I know firsthand I do it, you know, relentlessly make mistakes By

[00:21:13] Tyler: the way, I just want to point out their listeners Every time we start to get more and more, uh, intimate with the conversation, James keeps rolling away, keeps rolling back away from me.

[00:21:25] I might get a double

[00:21:26] James: shot of espresso too. I'm ready to jump out of my chair.

[00:21:30] Tyler: I'm emotionally getting too close for him. So he has to space himself physically. I haven't

[00:21:34] James: thought about a lot of this stuff in a long time either. You know, I didn't know you were going to come at me this morning and be like, Hey, you remember that time you were a dick?

[00:21:41] I didn't say that. I was quite

[00:21:43] Tyler: understanding.

[00:21:44] James: You know, the time you were an asshole. I'm like, Oh yeah, that sucked. I'm sorry. Well,

[00:21:49] Tyler: well, the thing is like, it's a lesson for people. I think we, we, um,

[00:21:54] James: everyone learned from my mistakes.

[00:21:55] Tyler: Well, I mean, like, uh, someone's got to show the way and, and [00:22:00] I, I'm the same way though, James.

[00:22:02] Like I. Used to have, my wife gives me shit about it now, even to this day where she's like, Oh, you used to be so, uh, protective and grumpy and upset about all the newness. And then you make friends with them and you realize, Oh, the shit that I was taught in surfing, particularly, it's kind of bullshit. You know, that localism there, there are, there are aspects to it that you're like, yes, but then there's like this whole, like shutting the world out.

[00:22:33] For to protect what you know something that you know, obviously is important But it's also like it should be shared with people because it's a beautiful Place beautiful activity beautiful things to do and you can't blame people for wanting to be part of it

[00:22:48] James: Yeah, no, absolutely not. I mean Montauk is a really special place.

[00:22:51] I mean I travel all over the world. Yeah You

[00:22:55] Tyler: said you said an interview you've been trying to find a a similar place to [00:23:00]Montauk

[00:23:00] James: and you know Maybe 10 20 years ago. I sort of found that in Uh, no Sarah. Yeah. I loved it. Yeah. But now guess what? It really turned into montage. I'm just waiting for another surf lodge to show up down there.

[00:23:15] And I stopped going, you know, I was like, Oh, well they found it. You know, and, and, and that was that. And I was like, and I keep looking, but you know, I, there's no place like it. There really isn't even in California. Like, I guess Malibu's kind of like it, but that's more crowded. And I found a couple of places up North in California that I really love, which I yeah.

[00:23:35] And, um, But no, you know, I, this is it, you know, and

[00:23:40] Tyler: it's a, it's a unique space, uh, because the

[00:23:43] James: people have so much to do with why this place is so special here. You know, even the new people, you know, it's, it's home, you know, it's my home. Yeah. You know, it's like, I, I can't give it up.

[00:23:57] Tyler: No, and you shouldn't.

[00:23:59] And it's like, and [00:24:00] that's the thing. And you're adapting and flowing with it as opposed to being a stone and trying to be rigid or about it, you know, and using a lesson in surfing, right? Like we have to flow where the waves are. You can't like anchor yourself in one spot and hope to, you know, To catch waves.

[00:24:17] You got to move around. You got to adapt to the conditions.

[00:24:20] James: Yeah. There's this one saying, you know, about resentments, which I, I love having resentment against somebody is like taking poison and expecting the other person to. Yes,

[00:24:33] Tyler: that's exactly it.

[00:24:34] James: No. And it's like, that's what I was doing. I was walking around with this like heavy rock for so long.

[00:24:39] Tyler: I'm like,

[00:24:39] James: why am I carrying this thing? Like, what is the point? You only hurting yourself. You know, I'm like, this is exhausting. You know, being angry is exhausting. It, it really is. And it's expensive. It's expensive. Because you have to

[00:24:52] Tyler: go to therapy. Yeah. And it does, it doesn't do anyone any good, right?

[00:24:57] Like, it, it doesn't help you. It [00:25:00] doesn't help, uh, the people around you. And, and I think, yeah.

[00:25:03] James: But I'm no Buddha. No. Let me just tell you that right now. I still have my moments where I can snap. Yeah. You know. But, but I, Reign it in quicker. Yeah, and I apologize faster, you know, and I checked myself You know like right away.

[00:25:18] I'm like, nope, this doesn't feel good. Look what you did here, you know, and I'm like, okay you need to go back make amends and Try again.

[00:25:27] Tyler: Well, that's the Emotional intelligence that's coming through, you know that that develops over time as as we get older I like to think people become more aware of You hope people become more aware of those things that they've been carrying their whole lives, you know?

[00:25:45] James: Yeah. Well, that's a whole, that's not even, do you want to go there? Do you want me to get the couch out? No, I don't want anyone to cry on the podcast. We're not crying this morning. All right.

[00:25:57] Tyler: Changing, changing topics here. Let's, I want to [00:26:00] talk about your, your artwork. Sure. And one of the things I noticed and things I've, I've also read was like you, you love to play and chase light.

[00:26:12] And I feel like lighting is, um, An extremely important element to your work. And, and I was curious, like how that developed for you, how the lighting aspect, particularly, I know it's important in photography, but for you, I feel like it's, it's almost the central theme. When I look around this whole room, it's the light that really sticks out for me.

[00:26:36] James: Walter Yost taught me that master of light, that man, I call him Yoda. And I had. The pleasure, the honor of being able to assist him on a few shoots and just absorbing every single second of being around him. Everything he said, everything he did, the way he moved. I remember we were shooting something for Golf Digest and we had to go to Southampton to shoot this golfer.[00:27:00]

[00:27:00] And we go to the guy's house and uh, we walk into the backyard and Walter raises his hand up. And he closes his eyes and he starts feeling for the light. I didn't really know what he was doing.

[00:27:15] Tyler: Yeah.

[00:27:15] James: I'm just watching and he finally like stops in this one spot. He's like, okay.

[00:27:21] Tyler: He's looking for the, and I'm like

[00:27:22] James: in the corner, like holding my hand up, trying to see if I could feel, I'm like, I'm not feeling any,

[00:27:30] Tyler: it's like a little kid, like mimicking their parent, you know, I

[00:27:34] James: was just imitating what I saw, you know, a lot of my photography, that's how I learned by imitation by like guys, like Matt Clark guys, like, you know, Nelly and T Cola, you know, snap water.

[00:27:46] Shout out, you know, I love, you know, Jimmy Wilson, you know, I used to call these guys and ask them a billion questions, you know, but getting back to the light. You know, that's my dad, you know, my dad's Greek. So he'd be like, you know, [00:28:00] photography, photo means light.

[00:28:05] Greek word. So I wouldn't

[00:28:09] Tyler: seen the, my big fat, uh, Greek wedding trilogy.

[00:28:14] James: So, so, you know, with that, so he's like, you know, without light, there is no photos, you know, sort of thing. So I've always, you know, I've always looked for it just in my day to day stuff. Now. I'm just like, oh, look how the light hits these trees at like Five o'clock and you know, that's sort of that gets ingrained in my memory, especially around Montauk I can tell you where the lights hitting at any time Yeah, any sort of day any season just because I've been studying it for so long even like subconsciously.

[00:28:42] Yeah studying it you know and um So, yeah, I'm, I'm always looking for, for good light and everywhere. And now they even have apps for that. Yeah. Where are the lights? You just close your

[00:28:54] Tyler: eyes and raise your phone.

[00:28:59] James: Oh my God. Yeah. [00:29:00] We had the Northern lights out here the other day. Tell me what, what was I have an app for that?

[00:29:04] You know, I use that app when I was in Iceland years ago to look for the Northern lights. So I guess they, they measure where the most. Magnetic fields are going to be in the sky and it was

[00:29:13] Tyler: right over Camp Hero, right?

[00:29:17] James: Oh, yeah, at all times, right, right, okay, yes, the beast. Yeah. Um, but no, I went down the Navy road.

[00:29:24] Yeah. I was so tired, you know, cause I've been working every day trying to get this gallery going and I'm exhausted and then I'm getting all the GMs. Hey, there's going to be Northern light. Hey, look right there on the screen. There it is right there. There it is. Right on, right on my frame TV, the photo of the Northern light.

[00:29:39] You can't see it, but, but it's nice. Um, so anyway, so I'm getting all the DMS, Oh, there's gonna be Northern lights. I've gotten these DMS like a hundred times. Like I've never seen the Northern lights in long talk and I've gone and I'd be like, stand at the lighthouse and I'm like nothing, and I'm in bed and I'm looking out my window and I know what the lights look out, look [00:30:00]like outside my window at nighttime.

[00:30:01] Cause I get like the orange shoes from town, mostly the memory motel. And I'm like. Those don't look right. That looks a little blue to me. I'm like, you know, I'm gonna get up I'm gonna go to Navy Road if I see something I see something if I don't no big whoop

[00:30:19] Tyler: Yeah,

[00:30:20] James: so I get down there. I'm looking at Connecticut and I know like the orange and red light pollution from Connecticut I'm like, okay to the right.

[00:30:26] That's absolutely Connecticut. I look to the left. I'm like That's green. I was like, that's that's green. Let's let's Set up a tripod and see what happens. So I do like a seven second exposure and boom. I mean, it is like,

[00:30:38] Tyler: wow, they're

[00:30:39] James: there. I'm like, Oh my God, this is sick. So I call my buddy, Jared Stiles.

[00:30:43] You know, I shoot with him and my man Sherm, like it's like the trio. And I'm like, what are you doing? I'm like the Northern lights. It's like, Oh, I'm just finishing up dinner. I'm like, Move your ass. Finish your dinner. Like the Northern lights are here. Let's go. And he [00:31:00] came down with his girlfriend and his father, you know, we all hung out and took photos together and it was really special.

[00:31:05] Wow. Do you know how many times you get to see the Northern lights in Montauk? I mean, that was with your friends and you kind of got

[00:31:10] Tyler: like a whole little like picnic thing going. It sounds like

[00:31:13] James: cool. It was, it was a lot of fun, but yeah. So. Chase the light even in the dark, you know, always got to chase it

[00:31:20] Tyler: when you start it.

[00:31:21] I just

[00:31:21] James: say one thing. So at the end of my emails for like, for like the longest time, my like signature was find your light. And I met Coco, you know, my fiance, she's also my agent and she does all my PR and marketing. And she's like, I love you, honey. She's You got to take that off.

[00:31:42] And I forgot it was on there for so long. She's like, it's gotta go. She's like, I love you, but it's gotta go.

[00:31:46] Tyler: It's too much. It's too much. It's too much. It's way too much frosting. Way too

[00:31:52] James: much frosting. I was like, fine, fine, fine, fine. So that was like one of her first, uh, jobs as my agent. It was like, we got to reboot.

[00:31:58] Yeah. Do

[00:31:59] Tyler: you? [00:32:00] Like, uh, when you started photography, was it your intention? Was your intention more to just do action surf shots? That was all

[00:32:10] James: I wanted to do, you know? And. It just started at Terrace, you know, cause how old were

[00:32:15] Tyler: you?

[00:32:16] James: Well, 16, 17. I was in high school and, uh, and it was your

[00:32:20] Tyler: way to get out of regular class.

[00:32:22] Right? Like, I just read, I do my research a little bit. Give us a story.

[00:32:28] James: So I was not a good student and I was, I was a troublemaker growing up and I hate you go to school yet. No, shut up. I was awful, you know, like I was the kid, like your parents did not let your kid hang out with, you know, I was bad, I was very bad.

[00:32:44] And so I figured out at a very young age, it's freshman in high school. I saw all the seniors and juniors walking around the halls of East Hamlin high school with a camera and like the hall monitors were just like, see the camera and everyone just wave at each other. Cause they realized, Oh, they're in photo [00:33:00] class.

[00:33:00] They're doing a project. They need to take photos. So I'm like, if I take photography class, I got a camera and I have an infinity hall pass and I can cut school all day long because the hall monitors change throughout the day too. So that's what I did. But guess what? The joke was on me. Because I took the class of Mr.

[00:33:21] Cohen and he was awesome. And he got me so excited for photography and I loved it. And I wanted to

[00:33:28] Tyler: do, what did it, how did he do that? Did you say

[00:33:31] James: chill guy? He was like your friend. He wasn't like. You know, like a teacher and he made it fun. He was like a hippie, you know, he had tunes going, he had the fridge.

[00:33:40] No one knew what was in the fridge, but I think it was a sixer, you know, and like me, you know, I just, he was just like, you're like cool guy stoner vibe at the beach, you know, just like that. Really cool. Not saying that he was smoking, but like that was the vibe. Yeah. And we were smoking. He wasn't smoking.

[00:33:58] I mean, he might

[00:33:58] Tyler: have been when he went home. [00:34:00] We don't know.

[00:34:01] James: But, you know, he was just so nice and awesome and just made it feel just like a safe space for everybody and then you go in the dark room and it's even more mellow in there and relaxing and I'm just like, oh, I love it in here. You know, and it made me just want to hang out with him and in that classroom So I'd like cut other classes go hang out in the photo lab, you know, like that's what that ended up happening

[00:34:24] Tyler: That's that's awesome.

[00:34:25] And a great case for electives in school. Yeah, for sure uh What uh When did you realize I could do this with surfing and, and who were, who were your first photos of surfing?

[00:34:41] James: So I used to sit, you know, I'd have my little fanny pack just full of rolls of film, you know, and, uh, my little Canon Rebel, you know, set to auto, auto everything, like plastic Tamron, 70 to 300 lens, like F11, like the worst.

[00:34:58] In the world, you know, [00:35:00] like anyway, but it did the job and I'd sit at the shoreline, zero foreground, just zoomed in on everyone's faces in the lineup, just 12 o'clock noon, as sunny and harsh as can be, and I'm just blasting away. And you know, what happened was Leif Engstrom comes up to me and he's like young back then, he's like, Hey, uh, so, ESM needs a photo.

[00:35:27] And I'm like, okay. Cause we didn't have any real surf photographers out here. So Jimmy Wilson called leaf. He was the editor of ESM back then. And he's like, do you have anyone like with a camera? Cause we need some portraits of Quincy Davis and leaf sisters. Uh, Alexis, I mean, Oh my God, they're going to kill me.

[00:35:49] That's

[00:35:49] Tyler: okay. It's okay. Okay.

[00:35:51] James: Alexis and, uh, Ariel, sorry, girls, I'm, I can edit this if you need.

[00:35:59] So anyway, [00:36:00] so Jerry Wilson, he's like, he gets me on the phone. He's like, this is what you need to do. You need to set your camera to 400 ISO, you know, like this time of day. You need light like literally like step by step like i'm a complete idiot No, no, I needed it. Like this is how you take this portrait.

[00:36:21] I'm like, okay

[00:36:22] Tyler: And and you're like what 17 18? I

[00:36:25] James: think maybe 18. Yeah. Yeah, I think I was just like out of high school and I was like, okay, so I go to quincy's it's her and paulette. They're like standing at their front door Well in quincy's like super little

[00:36:38] Tyler: yeah

[00:36:39] James: And so I take those and then I go to, uh, the Engstrom's and I, I take the girls and I have them racing in the backyard and Kathy, the mom, and they're posing with all their surfing trophies on their car and whatever.

[00:36:52] Tyler: Yeah.

[00:36:53] James: So I send it, send it off and, uh, ESM comes out and there's my [00:37:00] photos in the mag, like blown up big.

[00:37:03] Tyler: Wow.

[00:37:04] James: I'm like, this is freaking amazing. And I got a check for like 10 bucks and I was like, this is even better. Yes. I'm like, I got paid for, take these photos. And I'm like, wait, I'm like. I could do this.

[00:37:17] Like I can do this. This feels awesome. I love that feeling. And it was like a high, you know, like, cause I wasn't a great student. So I wasn't like getting the high off of like A's and like bringing home report cards. No, I wasn't getting any of that, you know, but like this was like a real accomplishment for me and it felt so good.

[00:37:36] I was like, oh wow, this is awesome. And I went home. Told my parents like I'm gonna be a professional photographer and they're like you're insane, you know, and everyone's like you're crazy What do you never do this? What

[00:37:48] Tyler: would your parents do if you don't mind my asking? No,

[00:37:51] James: that's a whole story. So my dad is a house painter and my mom Worked for the IRS for so long.

[00:37:57] She's a waitress [00:38:00] So my dad jumped ship from Santorini. He jumped ship in Boston with like five bucks in his pocket and was working in diners, you know, Greeks working. Yeah, they do. And his name's Costas. They didn't like that. So they named him Gus, you know, and he was just known as Gus. And, um, they met actually working in a diner in, uh, Save my mom was a waitress.

[00:38:24] My dad was the grillman and they that's how they got together and they had me They're good friends on salivars peach and pukas back in the day and said to my dad Hey, come check this out. You might like this. So my dad took a cruise out to Montauk Loved it went back up to so my mom's just pack up your shit.

[00:38:43] We're moving to Montauk nice and they did And, uh, they worked at Salovar's. They did. My dad was the grillman at Salovar's. My mom was a waitress. My other, my sister Dorothy was a waitress. And we were always in that business. And then my dad started his painting business. And they, my dad got out of that.

[00:38:57] And he did that. He still has it. It's been [00:39:00] going for like 50 something years now. He won't,

[00:39:03] Tyler: Yeah, that's what the, that generation, I know my dad too, he's 80, we celebrate his 82nd birthday, he's still working, you know, but it's, it's, I'm just like trying to get a sense of like that background. So yeah, like it wouldn't like photography art, cause we're not really present.

[00:39:17] Yeah. And

[00:39:19] James: I'm not cooking something. Yeah. That's not a real job. Yeah. You know, it's like nice hobby, but how are you going to pay for yourself?

[00:39:27] Tyler: It's a scary thing as a immigrant parent too, right? Like. You know, you want your kids to, to go further than you. And you're told like lawyer, doctor, you know, this, these are the

[00:39:43] James: You know, when are you going to start painting houses? Yeah, right? Where are you going to do

[00:39:46] Tyler: the family business? And I did that. And I

[00:39:49] James: hated it. I would sit there, you know, with my roller all day dreaming about winning the lottery. I'm like, I just need to win the lottery and I never have to do this ever again.

[00:39:58] And I was [00:40:00] miserable. Sitting in the van, smoking stogies and just having my coffee.

[00:40:05] Tyler: You know, but I mean, it's a beautiful beautiful Beautiful, uh, you know, there are some beautiful things to it. Like cutting, cutting a perfect line between the ceiling and the wall. Like, no, I used to paint too. I used to paint houses.

[00:40:19] So I know.

[00:40:22] James: Cause we used to have, you know, we own the MTK cafe in town. You know, we got back into the restaurant business as a family and I was the bartender in the back and my buddy, Mike Kalman would come in and he was a house painter and I'd be like, how's that going? And he goes. I love it. He goes, I love painting houses.

[00:40:38] I go into a room, it's terrible, and I make it and I'm in there and I make it beautiful and I just look back and I have this real sense of accomplishment and I go, nah, nah. I hate it.

[00:40:53] Tyler: So you tell your parents, I want to do photography.

[00:40:56] James: And I was in business school. I was going to college for business and I [00:41:00]was getting A's.

[00:41:00] Tyler: Yeah,

[00:41:01] James: when I was, and it was the first time in my whole entire life, I'm doing really well in school. And then I come home and I say, I'm switching my major to photography. My mom had a look on her face. Like I just like, you know, I murdered somebody. I'm going to jail for life. That was the look I got. Like you disappointing person.

[00:41:23] And, you know, and still to this day, my mom still goes, you know, in the winter, she's like, You know, my dad has a lot of, your father has a lot of jobs coming up. I'm like, mom, I am a photographer.

[00:41:36] Tyler: This is who I am. Except me.

[00:41:39] James: Still doesn't get it. She's my harshest critic too. I'll get like a cover of a magazine, you know, like yeah, remember that mag later.

[00:41:46] Yeah Yeah, I got the cover shot. I was one of my mermaids in Montauk. Yes. I was so stoked, you know, I get home I'm still that proud little kid, you know, and I I run home my parents. I'm like mom look Look at the cover shot. [00:42:00] She looks at me. She goes Not for me. I don't like, not your best. And I'm like, okay.

[00:42:10] All right. You know, I got, I, I hear you. Cause it's not like rainbows and sunsets. It's a black and white photo.

[00:42:17] Tyler: Of, uh, that series was a very beautiful women too. You know, it was, uh, she never liked me.

[00:42:23] James: Not for her, not for my mom. Very successful series, by the way. It was a lovely series. It was great. I love it.

[00:42:31] You know, people still come in and ask about it and stuff.

[00:42:33] Tyler: Well, it's, it's interesting. You, so your style, right? Like you. You shoot action photography, which is beautiful and right, you know, and then you kind of lost

[00:42:44] James: track about no

[00:42:45] Tyler: No, but it's it's interesting because like it's like you're it shows your weapon repertoire, right?

[00:42:50] Like you could shoot surfers action shots, but then you did this whole like model, you know people, you know black and white

[00:42:59] James: From [00:43:00] surfing. Yeah Explain the gist of this. Okay, so you know, I swim in my camera, right? And I love shooting surfing in the water. But I also love shooting portraits on land. I'm like, I want to shoot portraits in the water.

[00:43:14] And so Jesse just started Whalebone that year. Right? And he needed some t shirt shot. And so my friend Amanda Beckwith was, uh, helping us out with the on land stuff. And he's like, here, take a couple shirts. Go with Amanda, shoot some stuff, whatever you want to do, do it. And so it was in the middle of the summer.

[00:43:34] It was like August. It was a heat wave. I remember, and I said to Amanda, I go, You want to go like swim and shoot and take portraits under this dock at the dog park? She's like, yeah, that sounds cool. Yeah. And so the mermaid started actually as a whalebone shoot. So we're shooting these t shirts in the water and all of a sudden I'm like, wow, this is kind of cool.

[00:43:55] Like let's shoot more of this. And then it got a little bit more [00:44:00] intimate and they were, the shots are beautiful. We came back done. I went home, I uploaded the photos. And I got the whalebone stuff. I edited those, sent those off to Jesse. And then I had like my own personal stuff. And there was this one photo of Amanda under the dock and it's very angelic.

[00:44:17] And I'm like, what does this look like in black and white? Let's see. And I hit it and I'm like, Holy moly. I'm like, this is beautiful. And I showed Amanda, she's like, my God, this is amazing. But I had no idea what that was at that time. And so those photos just like sat in my computer. And for like a whole year and I was like, I don't know.

[00:44:38] I was like, I want to revisit this in the water. And I, oh yeah. And I said to Amanda, I go, oh my God, I was like, you look like a mermaid. I was like a Montauk mermaid. A mermaid of Montauk and like that's how that started just like that and then the next year I'm like i'm gonna shoot more of that Yeah, and it evolved and like at first it was like super gritty and grunt and grainy [00:45:00] And then it got a little prettier.

[00:45:01] It got a little bit more sensual. It got into a little bit more boudoir Yeah, and And then it got crazy and then it blew up. And then I had girls from like England say, I'm flying out. I want to shoot. Like, can you fit me in? And like, I had a full schedule, you know, of girls, like shooting, like every day, different, a different woman every single day.

[00:45:21] And it was, it was incredible. And it was fun. And I loved it. And,

[00:45:25] Tyler: and you, you, I imagine you learned a lot because you're shooting with people. And then I had to

[00:45:31] James: expand my crew. I was like, I need assistance. I need lighting. Like we have to. Get it right and you know going shoot for like an hour because that's like when like my perfect You know Time of light would be you know We had a small window to really get the shots I wanted and you know And and every girl brought something different to the shoot a different like mentality different attitude different looks Yeah, you know not every girl would look the same look right in certain scenes You know, I wanted to shoot all over Montauk and like [00:46:00] their personality how to match their

[00:46:02] Tyler: back You

[00:46:03] James: And honestly, that was such a really fun shoot.

[00:46:05] And all the girls did so well. And they would show up and they would be so timid. And scared and like, I don't know, man, like, I don't think I could do this. I'm like, you can do this. I'm like, I guarantee you're going to walk, you're going to walk out of here feeling like Beyonce, you know? And they did. And I still, and I still run into them today.

[00:46:22] Like literally just a couple of weeks ago, I ran into him at a coffee shop. And he's like, you know, I really want to thank you. You know, I had three kids since then, and I'm so happy I got those photos because I have those forever now. And I look so good. How

[00:46:34] Tyler: do you disarm someone? Who's talk to him nervous.

[00:46:37] Yeah. I just

[00:46:37] James: got to talk to him and talk to him about what they're doing in their life, their boyfriend, their relationship, their, their career. What are they doing? So

[00:46:44] Tyler: you're not like, you're an animal. You're a rabbit. Yeah, baby. You're a squirrel. I

[00:46:49] James: give them a little bit of direction in the beginning. Like, this is the theme.

[00:46:53] I put on some Lana Del Rey music to make it a little moody. And I'm like, this is, and they seen the photos. So they [00:47:00] kind of know in their head, like what we're going for, but you know, I just let them kind of just. Just naturally morph into this siren and they do, you know, first half hours, you know, and never use any of those shots, you know?

[00:47:14] And then by the end of it, by like, it's usually like a two hour shoot. They're just like comfortable. They don't, they don't see the camera anymore. They didn't see like my assistants around me. They're just like doing their thing and having fun and laughing and they all like, Oh my God, that was amazing.

[00:47:29] Thank you so much. And you can see like the high on their face after we're done. It was, it was great. It was. Honestly, it was so fun and so rewarding to see that and it made me so happy to see the girls so happy with themselves. Yeah. You know,

[00:47:42] Tyler: well that, I mean you, you're building that confidence for them too, which is, I wish I had some of that confidence, you know, you need someone to talk to you about what you're doing and put Lana Del Rey on, right?

[00:47:53] James: That's right.

[00:47:56] Tyler: Everybody needs a little Lana in their life. [00:48:00] It, it, it is interesting. Like I experienced that with the podcast too, right? Like it takes people time to, to warm up and you know, it's normally like. About a half hour. It's like the mic is gone. The photos are gone. And you're like, you know, I see, I saw you on,

[00:48:18] James: on the internet doing like your Pilates the other day or whatever it was.

[00:48:21] So like I was already unarmed

[00:48:25] Tyler: is kettlebell is kettlebell. And, uh, you know, like trying to, I have the same

[00:48:31] James: struggle on the same way, you know, after 40, it was all, you know,

[00:48:35] Tyler: Downhill, man. Downhill

[00:48:36] James: sounds easy. This is all uphill now. I know. It's all uphill.

[00:48:40] Tyler: It's, it's Sisyphean. You know, you're always pushing the rock up the hill only for it to come back down, you know, like.

[00:48:46] Yeah,

[00:48:47] James: and all my friends are like pro surfers. They all look like Adonis. Doesn't that piss you off? And I'm just like, you know, 5'10 and Greek and hairy and sweaty. You know, like, that's why I'm on this side of the camera. [00:49:00] Like, thank God this is podcast. I know. Right. Well, uh,

[00:49:03] Tyler: good thing I didn't bring the video camera now, both of us.

[00:49:08] But it's, so I want to get back then to the surfing, you know, you, you know, you're, um, you, what's I think really cool is you grew up in a, a time when it was like a, a real unique crew that of surfers, you know, really exceptional surfers. Uh, you know, a time when, like, it hasn't been like that in the past, you know, it was always more older surfers, not a lot of groms And the last few, you know, from like the nineties to now, well, we

[00:49:40] James: had that like nineties surfing era out here.

[00:49:43] We were all watching the lost videos, you know, like Gorkin doing the Gorkin flip and stuff like that. And then leaf, you know, was young and he started like doing like backflips at terrace. I'm like, what is happening? You know? And like, that was like the age that we were like living. We were watching Andy [00:50:00] Irons and Callie like going head to head and like competing and like, that's, you know, like, Shane Bashin and you know, like

[00:50:07] Tyler: all

[00:50:07] James: of the quick silver, uh, crossing town and stuff like that.

[00:50:12] And I'd be partying with like Kiala and all these people

[00:50:15] Tyler: got his start out here for a quick silver, like audition. Even, you know, I remember

[00:50:19] James: ball when he was, when he was really little, he would come out here and Nelly, cause Nelly was his guy still is his guy. And like, I'd seen Nelly show up with these kids and like will scoot and then stuff.

[00:50:28] And like, they'd go out to like Alamo's and when they were like doing tow I'm like, Whoa, like that's even more next level. Yeah, look like what's going to happen there. And, and, you know, it was right. There's like now balls a pipe champ. You

[00:50:41] Tyler: know, you were able to cap, like there wasn't anyone else doing that.

[00:50:45] No,

[00:50:45] James: just the guys that would like come out, you know, MJ,

[00:50:48] Tyler: you know, uh, Michael, uh, a little bit MJR was like it, but you know, a few others, you know, but there weren't anyone really doing that.

[00:50:57] James: Um, yeah, [00:51:00] that's, you know, it would be, again, it would be, uh, there was a few guys floating around and like my friends, you know, like my buddy Bart would be with me and like we had other photographers out here, you know, and like, and we all kind of like didn't really know what we were doing, but we're just trying to figure it all out together, you know, and like.

[00:51:19] Yeah We had photographers. I'm not gonna say I was the only guy. No, no,

[00:51:23] Tyler: but but it was of your generation your crew You know like

[00:51:27] James: Chris Cordon. Yeah, I'm your cordone used to yeah out here I don't even know where that guy but and you know, but Cola would make the hike out here all the time for any good swell, man, that guy has a shot of mine is one of my favorite shots of all time and it's on top of the hill when you're coming into Montauk.

[00:51:45] I have shot there since him and like all rights go to Tom Cola for that shot. It's looking over what now is the hero beach hotel, but it was Oceanside before the yellow hotel.

[00:51:56] Tyler: Yeah. And

[00:51:56] James: you sit up on top of the hill. As soon as you come into town and you get back, he's [00:52:00] perfect. bombing frames out the back, which are now being served by my buddies, you know, getting towed in.

[00:52:06] But they weren't really being surfed back then but since then every time I sit on that Hill I'm like Tom found this all zone. He was driving into Montauk one day huge hurricane swell I'm sure and he probably just looked up and saw this bomb coming through it was like Ripped the car to the side of the road and jumped out.

[00:52:24] You know, that's probably how that all went down and And that, and that photo was forever like ingrained in my, in my head. You know, snap Water, that was his name. Snap Water. Snap water. And he'd shoot Jesse and all and Leaf and all the guys out here. For the Huda guy? Yes, for ES. Theda guy. Guy E Sm

[00:52:41] Tyler: Oh, you know, I, the thing we all tried to try to strive for.

[00:52:44] Yeah. I got a couple

[00:52:45] James: Huda guy shots in there. . They did a behind the glass. It was, you know, Nate Adams was there at ESM and Dugan. Of course. Yeah. Jimmy Wilson and those guys really hyped me up big time and they would like call me and like Jimmy Wilson Let me tell [00:53:00] you something about that.

[00:53:00] Tyler: I wanted to get into that.

[00:53:01] Can you can you explain to our listeners who Jimmy Wilson is legend? Yeah,

[00:53:06] James: he's like one of the best photographers like ever. Yeah, and he's still going strong now. He's the editor over He's at, uh, well now he's with, uh, Volcom, right? Oh yeah, yeah. Uh, but he was the editor of, uh, trans World, I believe. Yeah.

[00:53:23] And Surfing Magazine. And because I, you know, and I'd be sending him shots. But lemme tell you something about Jimmy. This guy is busy.

[00:53:31] Tyler: Yeah.

[00:53:32] James: Busy guy. He would, I would send him when I was young, like 500 photos, crap. Garbage. Right. And he would. Send back noted photos with red ink. Like be like, why don't you stand here?

[00:53:48] Why don't you try shooting this way? Shutter speed should be here. Wow. Like really critiquing my work and sending notes and like [00:54:00] stuff. I was like, wow, didn't even think about that. He goes, you have a 500 millimeter lens. Go stand far away and get some foreground, you know, like that sort of stuff. And like he really gave me like so many good notes.

[00:54:13] I'm like, okay, let me try that. I'm like, wow Jimmy really knows what he's doing. Yeah, and he does Yeah and like even like through that like as I got older and we you know I don't talk to him as much as I used to obviously, but He was just always takes the time out of his way to help me, you know, a striving photographer.

[00:54:30] And now I try to do that for the younger generation as well. I say my door is always open. I will not gatekeep like these other photographers, you know, like, cause I got nothing to hide. Yeah. You know, like,

[00:54:44] Tyler: well, it's everyone develops their own style and, or you hope that everyone develops their own, their own style.

[00:54:51] So, it's not really a competition, it's just You know, a different perspective of what you may be doing.

[00:54:58] James: There's some photographers out there. It's super [00:55:00] competitive. Oh,

[00:55:00] Tyler: there are. Yeah. No, no, no. But I'm just saying your attitude is, is more of that kind of like, it's not a competition for you at least, you know,

[00:55:09] James: you know, I, I, I try to compete with myself.

[00:55:13] Tyler: Yeah,

[00:55:13] James: I know that sounds so cliche, but I really do like, oh, you know, like try to just outdo what I did, you know, yesterday and just be better today, you know,

[00:55:23] Tyler: when did you start to like go beyond the surfing and to do like the landscape and, and start to explore outside of surfing? Well,

[00:55:33] James: Montauk is just beautiful.

[00:55:35] Yeah. You know, and then, you know, yeah. It's the light hitting this place at certain times of day, like, oh, you just can't help but stop and snap a photo of it.

[00:55:43] Tyler: Yeah,

[00:55:44] James: and then I started posting those and like a whole other Crowd of people was like, wow, that's really pretty. I would like that in my bedroom.

[00:55:52] That would look nice I'm like, oh really? I'm like, yeah, could I get a print of that? I'm like sure. Why not? Yeah, you know I'm like 100 bucks Yeah, [00:56:00] you know back then. Yeah, yeah, you know sign a number 100, you know, and now it's a little different.

[00:56:06] Tyler: Yeah

[00:56:06] James: but um, that's how that all started it was just like people reaching out like, you know, I got a I Got my living room and I really don't I need something behind my couch.

[00:56:15] Do you have anything? Oh, I got something and that's kind of just how this all happened and just And then I started going heavy with it as I get older and, 'cause I'm like, oh, this is like, you know, a real business venture here. When when did, and then I saw guys like Aaron Chang.

[00:56:29] Tyler: Yeah. Who I

[00:56:30] James: love.

[00:56:30] Tyler: Oh.

[00:56:31] James: And Aaron Chang, you know, was popping up galleries all over

[00:56:35] Tyler: and he had the clothing line.

[00:56:37] Yes. And like he was quite ambitious. Yeah.

[00:56:40] James: Yeah. And I'm like, oh, I'm like, so there is other venues of, you know, of like, you know, money to come in here. Yeah. Serving does not pay the bills. You know, let's Especially

[00:56:56] Tyler: since the decline of all the magazines. Since there are none. Yeah. It's the [00:57:00]server's journal.

[00:57:00] Yeah. Exactly.

[00:57:01] James: Whitehorse in Australia. Trax in a few, and Sessions. Yeah. You know, but like, they just don't have the budgets like they used to. Yeah. Unless you're on staff.

[00:57:11] Tyler: Yeah.

[00:57:11] James: So I'm like, that's not gonna cut it. So, you know, my 15 check from ESM isn't paying my, you know, paying for dinner. Yeah. Yeah. So then I'm like, all right, I got to start thinking all this stuff.

[00:57:21] And I tried doing, you know, I shot weddings. I think every photographer's done that, you got to pay your dues. You know, I liked it for a little bit till I didn't. And I'm like, this is, you know, giving me anxiety. And I was having panic attacks and I'm like, I can't, can't do it. Like I can't shoot 30 weddings in one season.

[00:57:40] I, I ran myself ragged and I, you know, I was having a mental breakdown. I was like, I can't do this. It's not for me. So I never want to do that again. And I won't. Um, and so then I'm like, let's, uh, let's take. Surfing and like, okay. So then I'm looking at all these fine art photographers and like their work is outstanding.

[00:57:58] Tyler: Yeah [00:58:00]

[00:58:00] James: I'm like what we do is kind of difficult and hard like swimming with your camera I'm getting my ass kicked out there in like 40 degree water in the middle of a snowstorm like There's no one else out here snapping photos but me. I feel like my photos might hold a little bit more weight than some of this other stuff, you know?

[00:58:21] And that goes for all the surf photographers out there. We, we put our ass on the line, you know, for these shots. Like, not just spending the thousands and thousands of dollars on the gear. We actually put our bodies in very, you know, consequential situations. You get hurt. You know, and I'm like this, not everyone's doing this.

[00:58:40] I think these should be worth more money, you know, and I still feel that way, you know? So I started doing the art shows and like that and selling more prints and I started going heavy with selling art and all of a sudden one person sees me and then another gallery sees me and then, you know, and then Instagram is born and [00:59:00] that helps, you know, that's like, I mean,

[00:59:02] Tyler: next level then, you know, the reach, you know, your reach is like insane.

[00:59:07] Yeah, and especially You are

[00:59:10] James: in two shows right now. I mean one in argentina one tonight Costa rica, and

[00:59:14] Tyler: then you have one tonight. Isn't there like a little thing tonight as well?

[00:59:18] James: Uh, oh, yeah. Oh my god You forgot about that one. Yeah, dalton portellas gallery. Shout out dalton portella down at gossman's And that gallery's sick.

[00:59:27] He's right on the water in front of all the boats. He has the sickest deck and Dalton's like one of my favorite artists of all time and he's a good friend of mine. I love him And he saved my ass. I don't know how many times like in real world situations. He's like saved my life Really saved my life. I won't talk about it, but that man has saved my life.

[00:59:44] Let's put it that way

[00:59:45] Tyler: He and

[00:59:46] James: he

[00:59:46] Tyler: knows it. He is one of the Coolest people, like plays, can wail on the drums, uh, extremely creative, paints, paint, did all the movie posters. [01:00:00] Most people don't know that. And I'm like, all your favorite movies, yeah.

[01:00:04] James: Transform screen, all this stuff. Screen posters, Pulp Fiction, he put the cigarette in Uma Thurman's hand.

[01:00:10] And this is like, before Photoshop, he was all doing it. What am I

[01:00:13] Tyler: doing? Talking to you? I should be going to Dalton. You really should

[01:00:16] James: go to Dalton. He's awesome. He's got stories for days. No, he's awesome. And he was like living through like the craziest times in New York city. He lived in Williamsburg.

[01:00:24] Tyler: I remember going to New Year's Eve party.

[01:00:27] With my cousin and I'm like, you know, dropping knee and uh, all of a sudden I'm like Dalton, what are you doing here? And he's like, this is my place. I'm like, what?

[01:00:38] James: Yeah.

[01:00:42] You gotta go on a gallery tour at his house. Yeah. He's got the coolest stuff in there. And I have, I owned a couple of pieces of his work. Like I, I love his stuff. He was, One of my idols growing up out here for sure.

[01:00:53] Tyler: And I used to, and a great surfer

[01:00:55] James: and a great surfer. Yes. And a great surfer. I mean, he's multi talented.

[01:00:59] [01:01:00] Yeah. Yeah. It's he suffers from insomnia, just like me. Really get to talk late night.

[01:01:08] Tyler: What's that from? You want to talk about the insomnia?

[01:01:14] James: I've actually been sleeping lately. Yeah. Thank God. I think, uh, you know, So just run yourself ragged all day, opening a gallery and trying to hire staff and stuff. That'll wear you out. That'll wear you out. That'll put you to sleep. I sleep standing up now.

[01:01:28] You know? Do

[01:01:28] Tyler: you, when you have in some, is it because you have a thought, an idea you're obsessing over? Yes.

[01:01:35] James: I obsess. I obsess over my photography, a hundred percent. And my all, um, once I get an idea that I really like in my head, I obsess of it. I obsess over it till it comes true. So, you know, whether. work series, this gallery, I guess it's a form of manifesting, you know, and I just, I guess I'm up, I guess just [01:02:00] jotting notes, working on my computer, editing, uh, you know, just, Keeping my fiance awake all night long, but she has to wake up early for her own work.

[01:02:13] Go out and I'll get up and you know, sometimes I'll just get up and go out and shoot in the night and I'll shoot the stars. Wow. And just drive around and Montauk is amazing at night time when, when everything's closed and it's just me. I mean, I love that in the winter time and it's like snowing and I go driving around town.

[01:02:29] Three o'clock in the morning and everything's closed. But all like the old retro lights, like the signs, like the shag one lights is still on. The Montauk Liquor store sign is still glowing. Like there, that's a few,

[01:02:40] Tyler: few, you know, the lunch, the lunch, well the lunch. They

[01:02:43] James: don't keep the, the lunch sign on all winter

[01:02:45] Tyler: that, no, but it looks with the light like.

[01:02:47] It's just like, I'm looking at a photo right now of the lobster roll place, but it's, it's, it's interesting. Like a lot of creative people have that obsession and it's just really hard to turn off, [01:03:00] uh, that type of manic energy, you know? Um,

[01:03:06] James: yeah, I definitely get manic.

[01:03:07] Tyler: Yeah, for sure. Do you like in a good way?

[01:03:10] Yeah. Yeah. I mean, You've, you know, you have, uh, had some mental health struggles as, as I have, you know, like we've, we've both kinda, kinda had to go through some stuff.

[01:03:22] James: I think, you know, as I'm getting older, you know, I'm 41 now, and like, looking back, I feel like all that mental health depression, anxiety, and like, ugh, like really, really, I had it like severe, it was like really, really bad.

[01:03:36] Suicide, ideation, and all that stuff. I, I think. A lot of it was like, artistic process, you know, which is so sick, which is so sick and twisted.

[01:03:48] Tyler: But

[01:03:48] James: like, honestly, some of my best work has come out of me being so down and out. You know, like some of my most beautiful photos that you guys see, it's like, Oh, he must have been [01:04:00] so happy when

[01:04:01] Tyler: he

[01:04:01] James: took this.

[01:04:01] I'll be like literally like crying in my car, you know, like, Oh my God, I hate life. I hate this earth. I don't want to be here. You know, like this was a mistake, you know, like that's where I was, you know, and like I'm so glad I didn't check out, you know, because, you know, the miracle happened later, but you know, I just had to go through the, the shit, you know, and kind of work it out.

[01:04:25] And I did a lot of work, you know, I did a lot of therapy, a lot of intensive therapy for a long time and now I'm, now I feel good, I feel good about myself.

[01:04:35] Tyler: What do you do to keep? To keep your, your, keep yourself level, I guess, or above, you know, keep the, or is they, they've said that the little black dog, right?

[01:04:47] Like they call it depression.

[01:04:48] James: Yeah. Well, depression can hit a moving target.

[01:04:51] Tyler: Yeah.

[01:04:52] James: So I keep moving, you know, I keep working, I keep surfing. Well, I don't, I wish I surfed more. I haven't surfed in so long, but I bought a new board yesterday. So hopefully it'll get me [01:05:00] back in the water, but you know, I just keep creating art, you know, and now I.

[01:05:04] I'm expanding, you know, I'm not just shooting in Montauk. I'm shooting a lot in New York city. Yeah. You know, I have a place there now and I love shooting in the city now. I love shooting street photography. It keeps it really fresh for me. And there's always something new and downright crazy to see. When you coming out to

[01:05:19] Tyler: Rockaway then come on.

[01:05:20] We got a scene out there.

[01:05:22] James: Jump on the train and head out there.

[01:05:24] Tyler: I got boards for you.

[01:05:26] James: Yeah, yeah, that'd be cool. But you know, I just try to keep creating and, um, you know, If I ever do feel like I'm getting down, I, I take a, I just take a lot of pauses and then if I get like one of those bad thoughts, I go, that is not real that, you know, um, feelings aren't facts and it's true.

[01:05:48] They're not facts. Like I had, okay. I like that. Okay. So perfect example. Two days ago I had my soft opening party here, right? It was great. We had 200 people, everyone [01:06:00] was happy, having a great time. We sold a bunch of work. Uh, we had tacos, like everyone had a blast. The end of the night, I'm like, that was horrible.

[01:06:10] Oh God, this thing is not going to work. This is like, this was a mistake. What am I doing? And I say this to, to Coco, I'd be like, you know, we were having dinner. I was like, I don't know. I was like, there was nobody there. Nobody was there. No one showed up. Like we didn't, you know, we We didn't sell enough, you know, all this stuff.

[01:06:27] And she looks at me, she's like, are you nuts? She's like, it was fantastic. She's like, you had like 200, probably plus people in there. Everyone smiled. Like, go look at the photos. Go look at the videos. Like. If anyone else had this party, they'd be like over the moon, happy. But like my sick thinking tells me I'm terrible.

[01:06:48] That was awful. You should quit now.

[01:06:51] Tyler: You're not worthy. Everyone hates you. Yeah. Everyone hates me. That's,

[01:06:55] James: that's my, that's my immediate thought when I wake up in the morning. Everyone hates you. And I say, [01:07:00] fuck you. That's not true. And I get on with my day. Thanks for, uh, chiming in thoughts. I said, you have yourself a splendid day.

[01:07:07] I'm out. And then I go do whatever the fuck I want to do, you know? But like, like my base level is everyone hates you. And then I have to do my work on myself from there because that, that's my baseline.

[01:07:20] Tyler: You

[01:07:20] James: know, you're a loser. Everyone hates you. Um, you're fat. You can't surf well. Like, these are like my immediate thoughts when I wake up in the morning.

[01:07:28] You know, you're a shitty photographer. You're a hack. All these things. And then I go, Oh, thanks for visiting. It was a pleasure as always. I'll see you tomorrow. Fuck you. And I'll see you tomorrow. And then I get on with my day, and you know, and then I go see my friends, and I see my community, and I'm happy, and I talk to you, and I talk to my friends on the phone, I make phone calls, and I, you know, how's your day going?

[01:07:51] What are you doing? Let's stop obsessing about me, you know, like, what, you know, what's your day looking like? What do you got going on? As soon as I get out of my [01:08:00] own head and into someone else's space, much better neighborhood,

[01:08:03] Tyler: you

[01:08:04] James: know, because my, my head is a, is a very scary neighborhood.

[01:08:08] Tyler: Well, I was reading somewhere like, but

[01:08:10] James: it's work, but it's constant work with that stuff.

[01:08:12] It's always, it's always going to be work.

[01:08:13] Tyler: It, well, it's always going to be there. That, that depression, they, they talk, like, I remember when I was going through my, uh, my issues as well. And I remember watching this video about like depression and how they would talk about it. And also,

[01:08:28] James: uh, I was, uh, an addict and an alcoholic for a long time.

[01:08:32] And I'll just say, Yeah, I

[01:08:33] Tyler: was.

[01:08:34] James: I was a really bad drug addict and alcoholic, and I'm not anymore. I mean, I always will be, but I don't use anymore, and my life got better. Who would have thought? You put down the drugs and the booze, and your life gets better.

[01:08:44] Tyler: It makes such a, it really does allow you to see clear, more clearly, and, and, um, you know, that stuff is, is the escape, and it, and it doesn't allow you to see what, what really is in front of you.

[01:08:58] James: agent.

[01:08:58] Tyler: Yeah. Yeah. You [01:09:00] know, it's the escape. It's the thing that we can go and hide and, uh, forget about all the other stuff for a little bit, uh, because you're momentarily high or you're drinking and you're kind of clouding that vision. And once, once I, particularly once I stopped drinking and that was like, Oh my God.

[01:09:20] Yeah. Like, Holy shit. I would lash out at dumb shit when I drank, you know, and do the nasty drum. Yeah.

[01:09:26] James: I was a nasty, nasty

[01:09:28] Tyler: pick fight, you know, with my wife and stuff and like over nothing. Yeah. Yeah. Real dumb stuff. And then once I stopped, I'm like, I'm in control. And I'm like, Oh, I don't do that anymore.

[01:09:40] Or I don't lash out or I don't respond so quickly. You're able to actually process instead of knee jerk.

[01:09:47] James: Yeah. Yeah. You know, and you know, the, the great part about that is like, you can see clearly now. And the bad part about that is you can see clearly, you know, you can, you know, you feel your emotions, but guess what?[01:10:00]

[01:10:00] You get to feel your emotions. Like, Oh no, you know, it's like, you don't want to have, you know, you just raw dog and life out there. You know, it's tough, you know, it's tough and then It's work, you know, but we have tools now that help me along that i've learned along the way

[01:10:16] Tyler: and you learn to articulate What you need I think that's one of the things I've found.

[01:10:21] Oh,

[01:10:21] James: i'm hungry. Yeah, i'm not angry. I'm hungry exactly Well, it

[01:10:25] Tyler: is it's really like you start to look at like I never, I grew up never really knowing how to say what I want. I always deferred to people or tried to do things that I thought would please other people instead of myself. And, and then it would be like, you'd get this anxiety about it.

[01:10:46] And it was just all these, all the

[01:10:48] James: anxiety, anxiety was the worst. The next day, like, Oh, you're such a piece of shit. Totally the loathing,

[01:10:56] Tyler: the shame.

[01:10:56] James: Yeah, so much. And it lasts. And as you get older, it lasts [01:11:00] longer and longer, like three hangovers. I did not miss that one. You think I wouldn't, I wouldn't be sitting here talking to you right now, if I was still drinking.

[01:11:08] No, no. I would be. Missing because that's what happened. I go missing. I go missing for days, you know,

[01:11:14] Tyler: but it's it it's a It's a thing that always requires work. And and one thing I'm also curious like you've You talked about in one of your interviews like you've always felt you had to accomplish something or achieve like it was always like Constantly having to achieve.

[01:11:35] And those are ways to avoid, right? Like to deal with things and you're not in the moment. Another

[01:11:39] James: mask. It's just another mask. You know, like we're really good at wearing masks, drug addicts and alcoholics because we have to get by on the street. Yeah. So we have to present a different being than what we really are because we are manipulative and we want something from you.

[01:11:55] Yeah. You know? Yeah. And luckily, I do. Don't have to do that anymore. It's [01:12:00]like, whatever you see is what you get now. Yeah. I'm very happy go lucky guy. And,

[01:12:04] Tyler: and you can ask for what you want instead of have to manipulate for what you want, you know, it's a healthier way of, of going about it.

[01:12:11] James: Much healthier.

[01:12:13] Everyone's much happier. Um, but yeah, accomplishments, you know, I just, I always felt like I had something to prove,

[01:12:21] Tyler: you know,

[01:12:22] James: Growing up out here, I got bullied a lot. Yeah. Small town. I really, I really did get bullied a lot. It was, it was pretty rough. Yeah. The last name, like, Kachipis. Yeah. It was cat shit piss.

[01:12:34] Shit piss. Catch up ass. You know, getting pushed around. I wasn't, you know, Wasn't the cool guy. I was definitely the nerd. I definitely geeked out on Ninja Turtles and all that stuff. Star Wars. Didn't wear the cool clothes. I definitely was wearing like Oshkosh B'gosh and you know, whatever. But.

[01:12:53] Tyler: Well, you got to maybe avoid the Jankos at least.

[01:12:56] Nope. Nope.

[01:12:57] James: I was heavy into the Jankos and the soap shoes. [01:13:00] Zeke

[01:13:00] Tyler: Averici's at least maybe avoided. Oh my

[01:13:05] James: God. What was it? The triple? What was the other triple pleats in the triple pleated pants, you know, with the cargo MC hammer style and the cargo pants. Oh my gosh. They're

[01:13:16] Tyler: coming back to

[01:13:18] James: back in a big way.

[01:13:20] You'd think they would learn from our mistakes. Yeah. Right. Anyway, so yeah, I always had something to prove a little chip on my shoulder. I think that had to do with a lot being bullied when I was little and I just had something to prove. Cause I was always a loser. You can't do this. You can't do that.

[01:13:35] And I was like, you know what? Fuck you. I'm going to do whatever I want. You know, I had a lot of, I remember my first show I was down on the beach and I was inviting people to my first show. And one guy goes, why do you have a show? Who gave you a show? Wow. Yeah. I see this guy every day. It was one, it's one guy.

[01:13:49] He's, he's kind of mouthy guy. Still is. And I was like, all right, you don't have to come to my fucking show. I don't care. I don't even like you, you know, and you know, I had my show and [01:14:00] guess what? You know, so many years later, I'm still doing it. You know, imagine if I listened to what everyone was telling me my whole life.

[01:14:07] I'd be, I, then I would really be a loser. Cause I would be stuck in my home, not doing anything or, you know, or I would just be a lemming, you know, and doing the same thing as everyone else is doing.

[01:14:20] Tyler: Not that there's anything wrong with it. That's what you want, you know, but

[01:14:24] James: no, it's fine. I'm not, I'm not trying to be like, I had to just kind of carve my own way and just kind of walked my own beat.

[01:14:32] And that's what I've always done. And people have always not really liked that about me because I've done things just a little bit different and, you know, not really cared. Cause to a certain point, I'm just like, you know what I'm damned if I do, I'm damned if I don't, so we'll just do whatever the hell I want to do.

[01:14:49] Tyler: Anyway, people will respect it.

[01:14:51] James: You know, Alex, you know, a celebrity came up to me who I'm friends with and I was going through a problem because I. [01:15:00] Put out a pretty famous surf video when it went viral about a blizzard and a couple of local guys Didn't like it and I was getting a lot of flack, you know Anyway, you guys started it You saw me.

[01:15:17] Yeah They're all pumped when they got their photos and videos, but then when I started getting attention, it wasn't And, you know, some of the guys in the, in, in there, they're awesome. But like people is on the internet, you know,

[01:15:29] Tyler: armchair expert,

[01:15:30] James: armchair expert, armchair heroes. And you know, he comes up to me, he's like, James, you know, when I walk into a room, he goes 50 percent of the room loves me and 50 percent of the room thinks I'm a fucking asshole.

[01:15:43] Yeah. And that's just the way it's going to be in life. And I'm like, wow. That's correct. And like, so I kind of just live that way. Like, if you don't like me, that's fine. We all don't have to love each other. You know, like, we don't. You know, we don't all have to be kumbaya. We don't have to be mean to each [01:16:00] other either.

[01:16:01] But

[01:16:01] Tyler: it works when we all do get along.

[01:16:03] James: Yeah, it does work a little bit better when we all get along. I will tell you that.

[01:16:06] Tyler: How do you then And you, you've talked about like that, this constant trying to achieve. Then how do you enjoy the moment? How do you make yourself present? I don't, let's be honest. I don't

[01:16:20] James: enjoy the moment.

[01:16:21] It's not till later when I look back after I'm done with it. Then I'm like, Oh, that was a cool, that was cool. I'm talking like years later, like, Oh, that was really cool. Like, you know, like, you know, days like where I'm just like, Oh, I haven't accomplished anything. And then I'm like, wait, let's. Let's look at the timeline here.

[01:16:39] Yeah. You know, I'm like, okay, that was cool. I did that. I did that for Red Bull that year. That was pretty fun. Yeah. And you know, oh, I, I was in Ireland with those guys that year. You know, Ailes,

[01:16:49] Tyler: you covered like dude. Yeah.

[01:16:50] James: Ailes and stuff like climbing down the cliffs of More to shoot with Kurt Wrist and Dylan, you know, Scott and all those guys.

[01:16:57] Like that was an adventure. It's like, you [01:17:00] know, uh. Peru kidnapped in Peru. My buddy's like what? Whoa, whoa, whoa,

[01:17:06] Tyler: whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. Can we talk about that one? Cuz I spend a lot of time in Peru. So, I'm I'm curious. It's my

[01:17:11] James: first year and I'm stupid and me and my buddy's got into a fake taxi and they took us into the they took us into Calara, you know, up north into like this shantytown.

[01:17:20] All the murderers live and rapist. I'm I'm not even kidding.

[01:17:22] Tyler: I remember these cabbies and when I was in Juan Chaco, one of them did that to my buddy and I beat the out of him.

[01:17:28] James: Yup. And luckily it was three of us and one of him, but he was trying to crank up the radio to signal all his buddies to come get us.

[01:17:36] Wow. And I knew what was happening. I kept turning off the radio and he was getting pissed, I was getting pissed, and finally me, John Kieran, was like, We're gonna take this guy. Wow. And we got out of there and we finally made it back. And I remember we get back to our bungalows and the manager's like, Where have you guys been?

[01:17:53] And I like, I swear, guy, I wanted to punch him in the face. Oh, it's like 24 [01:18:00]hours. And I was like, it's like, where have you guys been? I sent the cat for you. I'm just like, ah. And then the next day we met this guy, Alan, this Peruvian guy. He's awesome. Still friends with him to this day. We met him in the water.

[01:18:12] He's like, oh, I'm going to take you back to Lobito's, a surf spot. I'm like, no, I'm never going back. He's like, no, no, you're going to be with me. Right. You know what happened? So we're driving along and I, and I, we're going by Calara and I see it. I go, that's, that's where they took us. They took us in there.

[01:18:27] And I remember this, like, it still gives me chills. He looks at me. He goes, wait, he goes, you were in there. I go, yeah. He goes, and he looks at me. He goes. You're a ghost. No one comes out of there. Like you go in there, you're dead.

[01:18:42] Tyler: I remember that drive to libido and we were all so nervous about bandits and all.

[01:18:48] We heard all those stories. It's like such a little sketchy little stretch to get to that town. And it's such a. It's such a weird town, too. It's an abandoned town, basically. One

[01:18:59] James: [01:19:00] five star hotel. Yeah, and then,

[01:19:01] Tyler: like, five point breaks, all, like, walking distance, basically.

[01:19:04] James: Oh, my God. I love that wave. I love that wave.

[01:19:07] I love surfing that wave. I saw, you know, me and Tin, uh, went down there with, uh, with, uh, Kaseya and, uh, Justin. Wow. With Jay, uh, Justin Adams. Wow. It was insane. I love that guy. He's like six, four, 120 pounds and just shreds on this tiny little twin fin, single fin things. Yeah. And we were down there and we have all the footage and 10 one want to do another.

[01:19:37] Movie, but he just, you know, just as an artist does he's just like I'm over it. Yeah, and I totally get it He's like i'm on to

[01:19:44] Tyler: pizza And ebikes

[01:19:47] James: and like that's his trip now That's totally his trip and like I get that 100 percent like because people like want me to like shoot the mermaids again I'm, like nah, that's not that's not it for me.

[01:19:57] You know, like I totally get onto the next day He's [01:20:00] like that with everything he does he obsesses. Yeah, and he's Crazy genius. We

[01:20:05] Tyler: are talking about Tino Hayda, who made a couple incredible surf movies, expensive porno movie, daughter paradise, you know, some classics, incredibly talented person also makes a mean pizza and

[01:20:21] James: big and bread now like he's, he's, he's just like someone

[01:20:25] Tyler: who just can take one little thing and then obsess and become a master of it.

[01:20:30] James: He's so. Freaking funny, man. Like we, he sends me some of the funniest texts, like out of the blue. I love that guy so much. I don't see him enough. I wish I got to see him more. He's so busy all the time now.

[01:20:42] Tyler: Yeah. Do you, like, how do you decide when to move on to something next? Oh, I don't. My body

[01:20:49] James: tells me that this is over, and it's boring, and I don't have the strength for it anymore, and I just don't like it anymore.

[01:20:57] Tyler: What are we, what are you focused on [01:21:00] now then? Or what are you obsessive on?

[01:21:02] James: I'm, I'm, I'm wanting to go back to film, to my green talk. That's my new series, green talk. I just, I just really like the challenge of it again. Um, you know, digital digital is great and I love it. And there's a lot of. Things you can tweak with digital and post and make it perfect But like

[01:21:20] Tyler: the developing the film up

[01:21:21] James: in the film scanning it in seeing I think the anticipation of film Yeah, what I love so you shoot it.

[01:21:28] I have no idea if it's good I have no idea if I left my lens cap on like I don't know what's happening like and you know, I'm I develop it and then I get it back. I'm like, Oh, these are, you know, I get some bangers, but then sometimes I do have a role. I'm like, Oh, this is all black. Nothing came out and that just cost me 60.

[01:21:47] Yeah. You know, cause film is so expensive now and there's less and less, you know, they're not making more of it. They're Fuji keeps dropping, uh, all the different types of film. Like every other week seems like, you know, [01:22:00] Kodak still putting out their portrait, but it's expensive. You know, my stuff's so expensive.

[01:22:04] But anyway, I really like it. I like shooting different cameras. They're all have like different Vibes about yeah, the color tones, and I love the green in it and like I get so pumped For it and like and I have no idea If other people like it, I know I like it. Yeah. And like, so this is like totally for me,

[01:22:27] Tyler: you

[01:22:28] James: know, this might, they might not be your typical touristy Montauk shop that like people want on their wall, you know, but I'm like, for me though, these are just feel so cool.

[01:22:38] Cause I know how much work I put into these photos, like timing, um, lighting, getting all my settings, correct. Shooting it. You know, really taking the time to plan out each shot, you know, intensively, you know, like tension to detail, really slowing down digital. You go out there, [01:23:00]you guys fired off a thousand photos and I'm going to get one good one when I get home.

[01:23:03] And if I don't, I'm going to make it good and post.

[01:23:05] Tyler: It always blows my mind when like I heard stories like art brewer went to the North shore for the winter with 30 rolls of film. And like his strike rate was insane. He would get like half of them published.

[01:23:18] James: Let's talk about Walter. Yes. Yes.

[01:23:20] Tyler: Yes. Your mentor.

[01:23:22] Would you say he's your mentor? It's

[01:23:24] James: just been a really good friend of mine. If I had to question him and his, his sons have always been there to help me out, Christian and Bjorn have always had their lines insanely

[01:23:33] Tyler: good goofy foots, right? And

[01:23:35] James: they surf really well. And they're insane photographers. Bjorn and Yos is amazing.

[01:23:38] Tyler: I remember going out to surf. And I'd be alone and then they would come out and they live right there. I was so intimidated of them because they were good looking. They surfed well, you know, and I wasn't from out here. So I was just like, Oh my God.

[01:23:54] James: Nothing to be intimidated about these guys. No way. Super, super nice guys.

[01:23:59] But [01:24:00] Walter, how about shooting? Like how about formula

[01:24:03] Tyler: one and other crazy like,

[01:24:05] James: you know, uh, Green Bay in the middle of a snowstorm with no gloves, fully manual lenses, uh, and like nailing, you know, a touchdown shot in the end zone, like perfectly timed, you know, blows my mind. Like how he did that, you know, like, It's, it's another level.

[01:24:30] It's totally, totally another level.

[01:24:32] Tyler: Yeah.

[01:24:34] James: And like this one shot, I have a couple of shots of his, this one shot he did of Greg Louganis is absolutely my favorite shot of his all time. And he gifted me a signed photo of it. I love it. And it's Greg Louganis doing a high jump and he set up these strobe lights.

[01:24:50] So when he's flying down towards the pool, the strobes go boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, and he catches them and he did it slow shutter. So it's like one over, you know, like 15 [01:25:00] seconds. Film and get this. And he told me the story. You get two tries because those high jump guys can only do it like two, three times because it hurts their wrists.

[01:25:11] So he had to nail this thing in two shots and he nailed it. And he went, he got developed. He loved the shots and he tells me the story. Walter has to tell the story. I know, but he told me, and I loved it even more because I can relate. He has, he's so proud of the shot. He's ready. He goes up to Greg, just look at this.

[01:25:30] Yeah. And Greg looks at, he goes, I'm bent.

[01:25:34] Tyler: I'm bent,

[01:25:37] James: you know, like, cause you know, that's like what they want. They need to be straight as an arrow, you know? Yeah. And he saw

[01:25:43] Tyler: the imperfection, all

[01:25:44] James: the imperfection, you know, but like he had no idea, like, What a one in a trillion shot that just was, that Walter just nailed in focus.

[01:25:54] And he goes to Walter, I'm bent. And, and ever since Walter told me that story, I'm like, that's my favorite shot of all time because [01:26:00] of the story behind it.

[01:26:01] Tyler: That is, I love that.

[01:26:03] James: Yeah. But Walt, you gotta get Walter on to tell you that story. How did your

[01:26:06] Tyler: relationship develop with him? How did you He needed

[01:26:08] James: someone to carry shit for him.

[01:26:11] He was doing a, uh, women's health shoot at Ditch Plains. Bjorn, I was in the city. Bjorn calls, he goes, Hey, my dad needs an assistant. Can you do it? And I'm like, I'm in the city.

[01:26:21] Tyler: I'm like,

[01:26:21] James: yes, I will be there. And I just like jump on the bus like I'm back. And Walter's like, yeah, you gotta be a ditch plane at six o'clock in the morning.

[01:26:29] Ready to go. I'm there five o'clock in the morning. You know? I'm so excited. Yeah. And all of a sudden a big trailer shows up and all like these. Models and crews show up and my first job, he goes, all right, amigo, and he sends, he gives me a reflector. He goes, your job is to make sure that the light is hitting, you know, the girl's butts when they're running up and down the beach.

[01:26:51] So my first job was running up and down the beach. Following these girls running and make sure there's light on there. Make sure there's light on their [01:27:00] tushies and backs. And so this is how I spent my first day in the professional photo field. And that's how I knew I'm like, I'm in the right, I'm in the right place.

[01:27:08] And I, and then, you know, and then afterwards, Walter's so cool. He's so inclusive. Like he gets the shots and we, we all huddle around and. There's all like these, you know, big time people. I'm like a nobody. And he goes, he's pointing to one of the shots and he goes, James, you know, I'm in like the back of the room.

[01:27:23] He goes, you see that right there? He goes, that was, that was you. You did, you did that. Wow. And I was like, wow, that meant like the world to me, you know? God, I'm kind of choked up thinking about that. Folks,

[01:27:34] Tyler: he's getting a little verklempt. I know. He's got a little spilkus in the genectic zoins. That's

[01:27:38] James: right.

[01:27:39] Tyler: They don't call me the Barbara Walters of surf, uh, surf podcasting here. I get everyone to cry.

[01:27:47] James: Why you got to do this to me, man?

[01:27:49] Tyler: It's not your fault. It's not your fault. It's not your fault. He just

[01:27:52] James: knows how to get it out of you. I had no idea what I was in for today. I've never done a podcast before.

[01:27:59] Tyler: [01:28:00] Now I want to ask, like, you know, I want to ask you, what day is this?

[01:28:04] And we are, it's a Saturday, right? It's a Saturday.

[01:28:08] James: We've been here for like, I feel like three days, an

[01:28:09] Tyler: hour and a half, you know, but I just want to like, kind of round it out here. We are in this beautiful gallery that you've just opened this week. Um, it's, it's absolutely stunning. And I'm curious, like, what first, like, What's it like making that transition to having a physical space that you now have to be Here, you know all the time and it's a business, you know, it's not yeah

[01:28:37] James: would do pop ups.

[01:28:39] Yeah

[01:28:40] Tyler: Yeah,

[01:28:40] James: I wouldn't do them often. Yeah, I don't want to be on like the craft fair circuit Yeah, I didn't want to do that. I did like my own pop up like I have this crazy idea during the pandemic I was like I want to do a A yard sale. I said to Coco, she goes, a yard sale. I go, yes. A yard sale of art, yard sale.

[01:28:58] She's like, no. [01:29:00] All right. And then like a couple, every year I'd say I'm going to do my yard sale. She's like, uh huh. Uh huh. And then last year around May, I was like, I'm doing it. I don't care. And because I had attic full of stuff, like years and years worth of my work. And she's like, all right, do a yard sale.

[01:29:21] I go up on Instagram. I'm having a yard sale. Come and get it. Discount prices, selling everything. Come on. And I said, 10 o'clock, I mean, uh, 12 o'clock be there. And I put everything out. I set up like a stand. I put all my prints out and I put framed work all over the lawn and everything. And Courtney comes out, Coco comes out.

[01:29:40] She goes, Holy shit. She goes, I had no idea you had this much work. I was like, yeah, I've been telling you, you know, I need the art. I got to clear out space. Okay. Everything's gone in one hour. Whoa. Everything gone. I had to go back in the house to get more [01:30:00] art. Wow. People were driving from up down hours to come out here.

[01:30:03] Wow. Oh, we're going to have a barbecue. We have drinks. I thought we're going to hang. Okay. There was no hanging I was working all day Like I didn't eat or drink a single thing all freaking day till the end of the night and I was gassed.

[01:30:16] Tyler: Yeah,

[01:30:17] James: but we sold Everything and made an absorbent amount of money in like two hours and I was like Imagine if I had my own space in town in montauk in the

[01:30:27] Tyler: summer

[01:30:28] James: And that's what I was like.

[01:30:29] I have to Do this now, not later now. Like if I wait too long, the prices of rent are just going to keep going up and up. This is it. Or else I'm going to get priced out. And luckily I, you know, uh, well bone, uh, the record shop used to be here and they, and they moved out. James, you should jump on that space.

[01:30:49] I'm like, you are correct, Eddie. Thank you. And I went down to the chamber of commerce. I said, I want this space. I'm getting this space. I said, I don't care what I have to do. It's mine. I literally, I went [01:31:00] up to Leo Don, right at the Albatross. He runs that and the bird on the roof. And he's the president of the board.

[01:31:05] I said, I'm getting that space. I said, I don't care what I have to do for it. I want it. And he goes, we want you in it. We want a local artist and I work with the chamber because they run a lot of their stuff. Yeah. Yeah. So we, we collab on so much stuff. So it's the perfect situation, perfect scenario. And the girls at the chamber are.

[01:31:24] Amazing. I love them. They are the best landlords I could ever think of. And they go along with all my crazy ideas, you know, which is, you know, I have a car blanche in here. It's great.

[01:31:34] Tyler: And so describe then, like how, what that process has been setting this up.

[01:31:40] James: Oh God. Um, so I had to come in, you know, you get the measurements and I had like, sort of like a dream about it.

[01:31:47] I've been thinking about, you know, like, again, here comes the insomnia. I'm just like up thinking like, what's going to go where. On the wall. What am I going to do first? Well, you know, I'd have to build it. Cause this place did not look like, it was a record shop, [01:32:00] you know, it, you know, I had to put in new shelving, new lighting, painting, like new everything.

[01:32:05] And, um, then you gotta find a contractor in the Hamptons before Memorial Day. That's not an easy task. Contractor, electrician, this is like a Hail Mary. And you know, I just kept getting lucky with stuff. You know, I, I found this guy who's like, yeah, I'm available. I'm like, I can get this done. Tomorrow. I'm like, what?

[01:32:29] Yeah. And he's been great. He built this whole thing for me and I had an idea. I'm like, what do you think about this? He goes, done, let's do it. But I designed this whole thing myself. Universe is

[01:32:38] Tyler: conspiring with you. I had

[01:32:40] James: some friends come soundboard, like I had Walt from the beach house. He's an, you know, Walt and he's an amazing curator.

[01:32:46] When it was nothing here, I said, well, please come over here. Tell me what you think. He goes, this wall's for this, this wall's for that. I think we should do that. And I took that, I switched some stuff up, but for the most part, I, uh, I kept true to that, [01:33:00] but, uh, I want it to be very clean going back to my cherished days, uh, very clean.

[01:33:07] I did have to utilize the space cause it's a, it's a smaller space, but it's cozy. So I had to put many prints on. Walls, which I normally wouldn't do, but it kind of looks like a record shop. Again, like the print section kind of looks like, Oh, your favorite albums on the wall. And then you look through the albums below and you could find that.

[01:33:26] I love

[01:33:27] Tyler: it. I really like the

[01:33:29] James: designs in here too. So you can come in, you can give me like your dimensions of your house and the wall and come in right here on the spot. I'll be like, okay, we can do this photo at this size and this price. Check out here, give me your info and it's going to drop ship right to your house.

[01:33:45] And you know, for a little extra charge, I'll even come in and install it with a crew, you know? And that's what we do. And, uh, we're just trying to make it easy. Eventually I wanted, I had an idea, like an Apple bar kind of thing. Like [01:34:00] the genius bar, you go in, you get four iPads and you swipe through the iPads, you know, I like this photo.

[01:34:06] I want it this size. Click that one printed on this, you know, acrylic that one and shipped. Here, this button swipe and there you go. And then you're out and then you just go

[01:34:16] Tyler: throw it. I'm going to, I'm going to one up you. Yeah. What you do is you create a, a light room table almost. But it's a touch screen.

[01:34:26] Wow. And then it's like, it's a Jedi shit. Yeah. Then you're like, well, what if we did this and that? Like, and then you can like, it's like the matrix in here. Totally. Like, fucking, that would be crazy. You know? And it's like, and

[01:34:38] James: we're gonna have holograms and like, you can, your, you can be your own house in here and see what it looks like.

[01:34:44] No, but guess I wanna do ar Yeah. You know? Uh, yes. With the little. Yeah, so you do that and then you can, yeah, and you can see it in your place, see what it looks like in your place. So that's what I'm doing now, like people, uh, send me photos of their walls in their house and I'll superimpose [01:35:00] like what the photo looks like on their wall so they can see it and I'll give them a few options.

[01:35:06] Did the

[01:35:06] Tyler: AI technology makes it so easy to do that? Like on canvas. Coco

[01:35:11] James: represented, uh, this guy who built this app called smartest. So Coco like helped like launch this app and like the app is insane. So you get on your phone, you, he has many different interiors that you can use and then you can upload your own art, whether it be a photo, a painting, a sculpture, whatever, and you can put it, place it in the room and getting placed at angles and different.

[01:35:34] So now you can take. Like a photo of your own room, upload that to the app and then take your own art, put that on the app. Oh,

[01:35:41] Tyler: I need that for me and my wife. Yeah, it's great. I need that.

[01:35:45] James: It's awesome. And so you can get a look at it. Like what it's going to look like approximately before you move everything around and spend a few thousand dollars on it.

[01:35:55] And so you got, you know, you have a general idea of what it's going to look like.

[01:35:58] Tyler: So [01:36:00] now comes the portion where. You have to do your shame shameless plug here. Sure where so like Where are you? Where is where are we located? Where can people find your work here?

[01:36:13] James: Um, so we're located literally

[01:36:15] Tyler: right in the heart right

[01:36:17] James: dead center in town if there was any more center in town I'd be in the gazebo.

[01:36:21] Yeah, I'm right across the street at 742 Montauk Highway in the Chamber of Commerce building So I'm on the left side and it used to be the annex and it used to be whalebone record shop Yeah Um, I will soon be taking over their side as well, although all those walls in there, but I wanted to make sure I had this done first.

[01:36:41] I mean, piecemeal this thing. I'm also going to be making a printing shop in the basement as well, and we're gonna be developing film, scanning film down there, printing, you know, I will have the light table in the basement. Me and Jared are That's a fall project. That

[01:36:56] Tyler: makes me think you're going to do something with the schools here.

[01:36:58] And

[01:36:59] James: [01:37:00] so we're going to be doing actual like activations in here. We're going to have talks. Um, you know, we're going to take out, need a podcast or something to do in, just

[01:37:08] Tyler: let me know. I'll get them crying for you.

[01:37:10] James: So Coco is Coco. That's her specialty. So she's already collabing with some people in the city, like, um, some art creatives.

[01:37:19] And what we'll do is we're going to come out here. I'll do a talk. We'll do a Q and a, and then afterwards I'm going to take all these people out and we're all going to go shoot together. You can shoot or you don't have to shoot. You can just come and watch and just like kind of just see what we do and what I do.

[01:37:36] And so, and then we'll have like a lunch and we'll talk. And then afterwards we come back and we'll have your laptops and we can go over the photos. We all shot together and put them on the frame TV over there and see what they would look like framed for yourself. You know, like We're going to do a lot of that.

[01:37:50] And yes, we're going to have the kids in here and get them stoked. Like maybe we'll do like an iPad, iPhone, uh, tutorial, photo tutorial, because you know what? A lot of people don't even know some of my [01:38:00] greatest shots I've ever taken on my iPhone. It's true. And I don't even tell anyone that, you know, one shot of seaweed that like people have like all over their houses.

[01:38:08] I was walking a ditch one day and I looked down right at my feet and there was this big clump of seaweed. That was so colorful. And all I had was my cell phone. It was like an iPhone four. And I clicked that thing and honestly, it's one of my all time bestsellers. It's been in like galleries in the city.

[01:38:22] It's crazy. You know, no one knows, but now they know.

[01:38:26] Tyler: I am, I'm super excited for you. I could feel the energy and the passion. And like, when you talk about it, like it's hard not to get caught up in it. And, and especially when I hear you talking about those activations and opportunities, like. This is gonna be like, a really great foundational place for people to come and, and collaborate even.

[01:38:48] I think like, you're, this will inspire more work from other people too, as well. Like, I think that's uh, gonna be, uh, One of your greatest [01:39:00] legacies potentially.

[01:39:00] James: Yeah, dude. I want to, I'm going to meet so many cool people in here.

[01:39:04] Tyler: Yeah.

[01:39:04] James: You know, I already have, I've been home in two days. I already, I already made like two really cool connections.

[01:39:08] Like with like really cool people. There's like, Hey, you know, I followed you for, for so long and I just never got to meet you and I'm here and this is what I do. And I, you know, I shoot this. I'm like, Oh, that's sick. Maybe we can do this together. And you know, it's already, it's already, it's all happening.

[01:39:22] It's all happening, baby. It's cool.

[01:39:24] Tyler: And now, where can our listeners buy your work online? So you can

[01:39:29] James: go to montaukimages. com and those are open edition prints. But if you want something custom, um, you can email us at hello at jameskachepasphotography. com And, uh, one of my amazing staff members, I have to do a shout out to my director, Amy Duryea.

[01:39:47] She is awesome. Fantastic. I love her more than anything. She is a godsend. Honestly, if it wasn't for her, the place wouldn't even be open right now. She does all the behind the scenes stuff, but she also [01:40:00] is my ambassador. It's phenomenal. And her family is like Montauk royalty.

[01:40:04] Tyler: Yeah, duriae, lobster, and uh, like, And my most famous

[01:40:09] James: shot of the dock and the seagulls, that's, that's her dock, you know, like, so when she comes in here, she gets to look at her own family's property as well, you know, and she enjoys it and she even says it, you know, she, she loves it.

[01:40:21] She's, she's a sweetheart. And we got, um, my, Diana's working and Erin. And Amanda and Haley Gordon's wow, no way Haley's awesome. Is

[01:40:32] Tyler: she back in town?

[01:40:33] James: She's sad, but she's going to be here on weekend. So come on in and say what up to her. Yeah,

[01:40:38] Tyler: dude, this is

[01:40:40] James: Amy got her. Amy, they were at like some, uh, some little beach party and she's like, yo, I think I got Haley Gordon for weekends.

[01:40:46] I was like, wow. Yeah,

[01:40:48] Tyler: dude, like this is a wonderful space and all the

[01:40:53] James: girls, let me just say all my staffs equally impressive. And if you come in here and talk with them, you will understand why I'm saying this.

[01:40:59] Tyler: [01:41:00] It's true. Even yesterday, like talking to Aaron here, like totally, absolutely lovely, super helpful and engaging and knowledgeable about everything.

[01:41:09] You know, it's

[01:41:10] James: and, and one, one more thing.

[01:41:12] Tyler: Yeah.

[01:41:13] James: My fiance Coco is my rock. She does. All the behind the scenes stuff. Whenever you see some sort of article, any sort of media, anything, it's her and her whole team busting their butts around the clock, like working for me. And let's not even talk about all her other many clients that she has, but she is a gangster when it comes to media and PR.

[01:41:38] Like everyone knows me when I'm here in Montauk, but then when we're in the city and go around, like everyone knows Coco. Yeah.

[01:41:44] Tyler: There's,

[01:41:44] James: there's shirts that says Coco made me do it. I think

[01:41:47] Tyler: we're going to, you know, one day have to do both of you on together at some point and have to get that whole love story.

[01:41:54] Oh, that is quite, that's a, that's

[01:41:58] James: a, that's [01:42:00] the, we met in the pandemic at, uh, a birthday party, her boyfriend's birthday party. Oh, we

[01:42:07] Tyler: are so going to dive into that. Another time, another time. So, uh, and the, or Instagram, where can, uh, let's

[01:42:14] James: talk grams. That's how everyone knows me. No one even knows me by my name, James.

[01:42:18] They just come, they see me on the street. They're like, oh, you're less talk grams. I'm like, yeah, formerly known as James. Let's talk grams.

[01:42:25] Tyler: Well, James, I am E

[01:42:27] James: T S T a U K. There we go. Grams.

[01:42:31] Tyler: So listeners go check out his work. It's, it's beautiful. It's stunning. It captures. This whole area and the charm that it has, um, you know, that I grew up with and, and I can feel it, you know, and, uh, also I'm just so stoked for you and, um, really, uh, appreciate you giving me the time here and to see this.

[01:42:57] And I'm like, really, it makes me so [01:43:00] proud. Like when I see New York surfers really. Uh, kind of find themselves and to really thrive and you like, you know, I've known you for, for over 10 years and to see you thriving is, is amazing and it's really special.

[01:43:18] James: I have to do one more shot. Yeah. Go. Shout. Shout.

[01:43:21] The godfather of surfing in New York. Will Scootin.

[01:43:24] Tyler: Yeah.

[01:43:25] James: That guy, let me tell you how hard that guy works,

[01:43:28] Tyler: dude. He's insane. He does

[01:43:30] James: so much for this community and the photographers. Do you remember the cold water, the yo yo challenge? Yeah,

[01:43:37] Tyler: absolutely. Come

[01:43:37] James: on. Yeah. Like give it up for Will Scoot and the whole Scootin family and Cliff and Everybody like they do so much for everyone and he's like the most The nicest man on the planet always good vibes and he charges Nazare.

[01:43:53] Come on

[01:43:54] Tyler: It's it's so funny. Like will is Like what we should [01:44:00] strive for I think and it's funny like when I first met him I remember being like, all right, what's the angle? No, and there's no angle. It's just pure love and and Yeah, he he and his family and and and they've all just they've engaged all the parts of the new york surf community Because we are kind of separated in some ways And he's that really nice Thread that kind of connects it all.

[01:44:28] And I think it really, you know, helps, helps open opportunities for so many surfers here. Uh, it's been really, I know

[01:44:36] James: I'm forgetting so many people you're going to forget, but it's okay. It's

[01:44:39] Tyler: okay. We're not going to. You know, this is a podcast, not an award show. You don't have to read off a full list, but it's all good.

[01:44:46] I can hear the music now. Time to get off the stage, but James, I'm really stoked. And I really appreciate your time here and listeners. I really [01:45:00] recommend you check out his work. My favorites are the frozen docs. Like those are like the best shots are so amazing, but you. You've really outdone yourself here.

[01:45:09] And so anyone who comes out to Montauk, please stop by this gallery. It's stunning. And, uh, yeah. And thank you for listening and, uh, hope you enjoyed this incredible, uh, incredible conversation. I really enjoyed, and I appreciate you opening up James and, uh, being vulnerable. Uh, it does mean a lot and yeah, and listeners, uh, thank you for listening to us, uh, bullshit, uh, for an hour and a half and, uh, we'll check you all down the line soon.

[01:45:41] Thank you. Thank you.