Wave of Mutilation with Justin Schwartz

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[00:00:00] Tyler: Hello, and welcome to the Swell Season Surf Podcast. I'm your host, Tyler Brewer. Mention the name Justin Schwartz to a number of OG New York surfers, you'll get a variety of reactions. From surfing savant, to great friend, to killer taco proprietor, to fuck that guy. Justin invites a variety of opinions.

[00:00:26] Tyler: One of my earliest memories of Justin was as a teenage grommet, goofing around on logs, whom I looked up to and would enjoy surfing with. Justin has lived many lives, from being a banker and working in finance, to competing in top level competitions and representing New York, to owning and establishing one of Long Island's premier taco joints, Matta Taco.

[00:00:52] Tyler: Justin has chosen a life less ordinary, and has lived it to the fullest. He's a New York surfing staple. [00:01:00] You can find him cross stepping at Ditch or pulling in behind the curtain at Lido. His surfing is versatile and has no doubt had an influence on the younger generations. I'm stoked to welcome on to the Swell Season podcast, Justin Schwartz.

[00:01:17] Tyler: How was the trip in?

[00:01:19] Justin: Uh, relatively easy, it's the Jitney, it's like first stop to the last stop, pretty much. But

[00:01:25] Tyler: you're coming in to pick up a board?

[00:01:26] Justin: was trying, it's not gonna, I'm not gonna be able to work it out with, uh, Kings.

[00:01:31] Tyler: Oh, really?

[00:01:31] Justin: I, when, uh, Christian Beamish was here in early July, I had, he did a 7'5 uh, mid length for black belts for me.

[00:01:42] Tyler: Oh, wow.

[00:01:42] Justin: a 9'1 that, uh, Trent from Enlighten got for

[00:01:46] Tyler: Mm hmm.

[00:01:47] Justin: Uh, And it's awesome, but it's a little bit more of a glider until it gets, like, a huge day. And then it, like, really will come alive. And I was like, I wanted something I could, like, stuff in a pocket more. Uh, without, like, really [00:02:00] having to telegraph the setup.

[00:02:02] Tyler: What do you, what do you think of the Beamish designs?

[00:02:05] Justin: Phenomenal. I mean, coming, for me, coming from that Parrish, single fin mentality,

[00:02:13] Tyler: Chandler, you and your single fin mentality. Yeah.

[00:02:16] Justin: Totally. But in the Channel Bottoms, he has a very much, uh, like Mourning of the Earth influenced. And, you know, he credits them a ton. Uh,

[00:02:29] Tyler: was that the Simon Jones or whatever? Yeah.

[00:02:32] Justin: So he does that, right? I've the Rifle Ranger from Christian Beamish, which is like a.

[00:02:38] Justin: Ridiculous twin fin channel bottom. Um, and you get with those boards, the same confidence that you do with the parishes, like, you know, if you're going to make it to your feet, you can trust the board to make the

[00:02:50] Tyler: Yeah. Do you like, how do they feel on the smaller, flatter, weaker waves? Like, I always, [00:03:00] I always, I'm like, oh, I'd love a channel bottom, but then I'm always like, well, when am I gonna use, when am I gonna use it, you know?

[00:03:09] Justin: with a long, with the nine one, you know, it becomes more of like on the smaller days, you're just using it as a long

[00:03:15] Tyler: yeah, yeah.

[00:03:17] Justin: or like a substitute to a long board. So if it's like a. One to two foot, really racy bully day, like just screaming down the line. You can cheater five those things and still, you know, get a proper, you know, step back on the tail and do a proper turn.

[00:03:34] Justin: And he says like, uh, Beamish says, whether it's a small or big wave, you're going to change the fins from like that parish, the power seven and a half. to go into like a green out like nine and a half. So the smaller days you use like that narrower based fin that's a little longer and you're going to get like a little more flick out of it, I guess.[00:04:00]

[00:04:00] Justin: The seven and a half that parish is super wide base and it it's crazy. As I always would think a bigger fan on such a big board, but it. The fin works really well.

[00:04:11] Tyler: Do you, are you still riding your Parrish

[00:04:14] Justin: Oh yeah, hell yeah.

[00:04:15] Tyler: You got any new ones in?

[00:04:17] Justin: I got, I've only got one in the last couple of years. Um, luckily, or however you, however you want to call it. Tom relocated from Maui.

[00:04:31] Justin: To France, like right before the fires. So, you know, lucky but unlucky. Uh, you know, unlucky for the people who are still there. And then, Tom definitely felt at a loss being in France. And, you know, everyone out of communication. A lot of his friends lost everything. Heavy.

[00:04:51] Tyler: Dude, it's fucking horrendous and like Unfortunately, the news cycle seems to have moved on too, you know? And it's [00:05:00] like

[00:05:00] Justin: was

[00:05:01] Tyler: It sucked. It was a shit situation. You have friends over there, I imagine. A couple,

[00:05:06] Justin: A couple, yeah, a couple that we have, you know, and some, and like I said, some people lost everything. Some people, a lot of people from Montauk had, uh, condos in Lahaina, uh, like their retirement condos that they've had for 10, 15 years. Those are cool. All of them are gone.

[00:05:24] Justin: All of them are gone, you know, and they, you know, they're, it's our second home. We're fortunate. We still have our main home. Uh, you know, they're more concerned for their friends who were there full time. Yeah. Um, but yeah, it seems like with every disaster, it's, you get a six months of like, maybe at most, and then it's gone and forgotten.

[00:05:45] Justin: You know, Sandy is a perfect example. You know, six months out, and you're like, Fuck, I still don't have electricity, I still don't have running water, My basement's still full of shit, I like, really we're focused on whatever else, how about like [00:06:00] Someone besides Red Cross come in and do something right for once.

[00:06:04] Justin: And that's always how it

[00:06:05] Tyler: You were in Long Beach, right? Yeah. At the time? Yeah. What happened for you guys there? How bad, how bad You were right on the

[00:06:13] Justin: Yeah, we were on Reynolds Channel. Down the block from Minnesota's. Um, yeah. I think the only upside for us was we got hit in Irene the year before. Where a lot of Long Beach got spared.

[00:06:29] Tyler: I remember.

[00:06:29] Justin: Um, so when Sandy looked like it was gonna be a fuck you up. Where Irene looked pretty, pretty okay.

[00:06:38] Justin: We, we started to, um, take some measures before some other people did. And Ernie was like, why are you so stressed out? And I was like, man, not going to lose everything again. And like. Go to a neighbor and I was like, Hey, we're going to put the generator up on the third floor. And they're like, why? And I was like, well, cause when the basement and the first floor [00:07:00]got washed away, the toolbox and the generator, everything are going to be up top.

[00:07:04] Justin: Even if the windows get blown out, it's still not under 20 feet of salt water or 10 feet of salt water. And, uh, yeah, you know, I would, I think that we were lucky. Because I had friends upstage who sent some guys to help us out. Um, it was impossible to find help. Um, you know, everyone Your buddy who's an electrician or a plumber or whatever who could help you out is like, Dude, I lost my fucking house too. I'm just as screwed as you are. And by the way, I left my tools in the basement. Ha

[00:07:43] Tyler: qualified electrician, you, you know, they were booked for, for like years after. I remember like, you know, and like. In New York City, in like Rockway, I remember, we were all like, Can we get people? And they're like, No, because you have to be a certain code, too, for New York [00:08:00] City, which is different than Long Island, which also made it like, really difficult.

[00:08:04] Justin: I, I think where. For those first few months, it was so Wild West. If you were just able to get someone in and slap some shit together, then they're like, they would come do an inspection, they're like, when the f when did you get this done?

[00:08:19] Justin: And you're always like, eh, well, I kinda like, you know, slapped some shit together, they're

[00:08:24] Tyler: can

[00:08:25] Justin: they're like, oh, yeah, we can kinda stamp, and who'd you get anyway? I need that in my house, too. So that, you know, you kinda let stuff slide. And, and like I said, Yeah, the building inspectors in Long Beach or wherever, you were all in the same position.

[00:08:41] Justin: So. In an instance where, probably in the past, if you did some shit that was a little fugazi and you said to someone, You know, cut me some slack. They'd be like, it's my fucking job, I'm not cutting you anything. Here, in this instance, they're like, cut me some slack. Look, I'm ba I [00:09:00] got heat. Do you want a glass of water?

[00:09:02] Justin: You want a cold beer out of the fridge? Can you cut me some slack on this one? Oh yeah.

[00:09:08] Tyler: you cut me some slack on this one? Oh yeah.

[00:09:14] Justin: Uh,

[00:09:24] Justin: See you later. Five to six months. Five to six months and we were, we were one of the first. You know, for sure. Because a lot of people were waiting, you know, for insurance payouts, for this, that, and the other thing. We knew, uh, We weren't gonna be able to raise the house. So that just said us. Okay. This is what we can do But other people yeah, gosh, I remember some like the first person in Long Beach to raise their house And [00:10:00] then, you know, they, boom, someone, they got someone from down south, they raised a house, and it's like, uh, miscommunication between FEMA and New York State, how high you're supposed to raise a house, and they're like eight inches short of how, of how tall the house was supposed to be raised, and you're like, no fucking way.

[00:10:18] Justin: And they're like, FEMA said this, and we just followed the, but New York State hadn't set the new guideline yet, and like, now we gotta get it. And I was like, throw some cinder blocks on it. Like eight inches,

[00:10:31] Tyler: I would just dig sand around the foundation of that 8 inches and be

[00:10:35] Justin: so many things that, you know, we're like, people You know, steps, like, they, you're like, oh, you're within your, uh, property, but now your steps are out on the road, you can't do that.

[00:10:49] Justin: And you're like, where am I gonna put my steps? They're like, figure it out. Have you thought about putting an elevator in the house? You're like, dude, come on.

[00:10:56] Tyler: Spiral staircase?

[00:10:57] Justin: have no money, you know, and no one had any money [00:11:00] left, you know.

[00:11:01] Tyler: Pulley system.

[00:11:02] Justin: Totally, totally. A dumb waiter?

[00:11:04] Tyler: Dumbwaiter. We're not making fun of waiters. For those of you who aren't aware of what a dumbwaiter is. Um, it's crazy like how West Long Beach now is like everything is raised up now though. It's so wild and I would dare say that it's added value to those homes quite a bit though too.

[00:11:24] Tyler: Because it's just added so much more square footage to them as

[00:11:28] Justin: Yeah, for sure. I mean, some people, I think once someone went really big on one block and the neighbors were just like, hey, they got the okay, we're good to do that. And they're like, well, you kind of can't go above this site. And they're like, well, Not to be a dick, but so and so just did and they're like, well, don't go above that height then.

[00:11:51] Tyler: The firehouse was raised above it. No, I'm just kidding. I still

[00:11:55] Justin: able to see the flagpole at the firehouse, so I gotta go up a little taller.[00:12:00]

[00:12:00] Tyler: how long was that then until you moved out of Long Beach? And what was the reason for that? Uh, Mm hmm.

[00:12:13] Justin: My ex and I that it seemed like after Sandy That the island had sunk a little bit, and that every nor'easter, whereas like we never had it happen before, every nor'easter the basement would fill up with water. Two feet, four feet of water, and you're like, you don't mind it when it's like October or April, but when it's like February and you gotta go with like your 5'4 your booties, and like turn the pump on, and you're like, did the pump kick on?

[00:12:47] Justin: And you're like, shit, it didn't kick on, alright, here we go again. Um. And it just, the house, it continued, it got worse and worse as it went, you know, one year, two years, the third [00:13:00] year, um. And I distinctly remember someone, uh, a gentleman came and knocked on the door one day, and I was at the house, and I was talking with my ex, and he was like, hey, I want your house. was like, well, it's not for sale, and he was like, well, everything's for sale, and he kind of made an offer, and I was like, yeah, I think we're moving. And that was, you know, I think we, it was, it, you definitely got like a bit of PTSD, um. And amongst other things, just like seeing your neighbors still not in, seeing your neighbors houses get torn down, knowing they were never going to come back, um, and just a lot of things, dealing with the blow in they're doing, just the Insurance, following the insurance money, you know, they just follow disaster to disaster.

[00:13:59] Justin: Um, [00:14:00] and God bless them, but some of them are just not the best people to have around after a disaster because they're fucking disasters themselves. And you're on, and at the same time you're on the cusp of becoming a disaster and you're trying to do everything to maintain your sanity and not. Just go into like total meltdown mode is it just you'd be like a month later, and there's still boats all Over Island Park, and you're like when is that boat gonna get out of here?

[00:14:32] Justin: You know you're driving down to Oceanside Road. It's like when are they gonna get that boat out of here? Do you think they're gonna get the sand out of that building you know and to this day you still see buildings that are just half Yeah, half finished. Mm

[00:14:49] Tyler: pallets, you know, and they're not very sound and you're like, how did that get there?

[00:14:54] Justin: And it gets, you know, so you definitely go, going back, sometimes [00:15:00] it's, it's tough.

[00:15:01] Justin: And, you know, I, I feel like now it's been, how many years? 14 years? Something like that. That,

[00:15:13] Tyler: 12 years, you know, at least,

[00:15:14] Justin: people,

[00:15:16] Tyler: yeah,

[00:15:17] Justin: So like, not even just the six months after, but now people are like, well, that shit's not going to happen. And I'm like, fuck dude. It's like we live on an island that faces South in the middle of the Atlantic ocean.

[00:15:30] Justin: We're, we're the magnet

[00:15:32] Tyler: level is rising where, you know, like it is sea levels rising. It's going to happen. I mean, we, I should, I'm the one to talk. I mean, we, I moved to Rockaway. , yeah. But, but they built a really good solid boardwalk. And I'm on the third floor, so

[00:15:50] Justin: Oh yeah, dude, that that's at least one story above when the shit hits the fan.

[00:15:55] Tyler: Um, do you, so do you remember when we were [00:16:00] grommet surfing? Oh,

[00:16:00] Justin: Oh, absolutely.

[00:16:01] Tyler: Lido Beach like that? Like I always Malibu. Yeah. Mm-hmm . Well, I always think back like. To me, there's this session where, um, we were at Lido riding longboards when it wasn't cool for younger people to ride longboards too. And I just, I just have this memory of like you and I just like sharing waves, splitting waves all the time.

[00:16:24] Tyler: And I always like looked up to you at that time. And you, you're older. Yeah, I'm

[00:16:30] Justin: I look better than you. I

[00:16:32] Tyler: I don't have any hair.

[00:16:34] Justin: I know. Where'd it

[00:16:35] Tyler: but you know what? Like, you, you're the one that's lived probably a more radical life. You should look older. Yeah. Sometimes I feel

[00:16:43] Justin: I feel it, for sure. I feel it.

[00:16:45] Tyler: has gone, like, full zigzags. Yup.

[00:16:49] Justin: I'll, uh, I think I was Yeah, I mean going back to when we were groms and riding old school longboards.

[00:16:58] Justin: Not, not [00:17:00] like the two plus ones. They're so easy to come by. Um, I had my first board, which I got a longboard shortly after. My first board was a 5'10 cyclone. A Jeff, a Jeff Bushman.

[00:17:15] Tyler: Whoa! Super,

[00:17:21] Justin: 1990 ish, so I'm gonna rep and I was skateboarding a ton. I was like, I can't catch I couldn't I couldn't catch a cold on that wave.

[00:17:32] Justin: And I grew up at the beach. So like, I kind of understood the paddling war. I thought I did. And I remember going to Lincoln one day with my parents and seeing, you remember Ira?

[00:17:45] Tyler: Oh yeah, I remember Ira

[00:17:46] Justin: So, and seeing Ira on an old school lug, and I'm like, this fat fuck is

[00:17:52] Tyler: Yeah,

[00:17:53] Justin: every wave. Like some waves he didn't even paddle for and he caught him, or that's how I remember it.

[00:17:58] Justin: And I'm like, Dad, what the [00:18:00] fuck is this guy doing? And he's like, that guy's catching every wave. And I was like, uh, like Dude, I

[00:18:06] Tyler: I need

[00:18:07] Justin: man I gotta, this is like, I gotta dump this shitty, and by no means was the board shitty, and I think, like I would kill to get that board back now, cause I, like it was, so it was probably made in the late 80s, so it probably had some decent beef to it, but I just remember it just being so hard.

[00:18:25] Justin: So, go on Newsday Classifieds, and I found um, Uh, Dewey Webber, a seven stringer D Fin, uh, that was shaped by Iggy.

[00:18:36] Tyler: No

[00:18:37] Justin: Yeah, and the guy was like, I got it.

[00:18:39] Tyler: ha

[00:18:40] Justin: did he get it? At Tent City. He got it at Tent City, and he was the original owner, and he's like, I've had it in my basement for 25 years. He's like, did you get to like ride it?

[00:18:53] Justin: And I was like, yeah, totally. And he's like, all right, give me 85. It's yours. And I was like, [00:19:00] great. And next day I was like, go to the beach. And I was like, you want to sell that board? And I was like, oh, I must've gotten a good one. He's

[00:19:08] Tyler: He's like, I'll give you 200 for it. You're like, sweet. I just doubled my profit. All right.

[00:19:12] Justin: suck it, surfing bagel.

[00:19:13] Justin: I'm not giving you this board. I must be on to something. I would say, um, so probably the next year, I would have got my license, and that's probably when I started surfing Lido a lot more, uh, cause you could go through the hole in the fence at the towers. Yeah, park

[00:19:34] Tyler: was the time when we could sneak through.

[00:19:37] Justin: and just cut through the hole in the fence, and uh, we would all surf right around there.

[00:19:43] Tyler: How funny was it when they started like. Putting glass on the the fence and everything broken glass to try to prevent and they were trying to do all these things

[00:19:51] Justin: And inevitably, the next one would be like, oh, there's a new hole in the fence. It's like five feet away from the old hole. It

[00:19:58] Tyler: It was like everyone [00:20:00] did it like my stepdad did it we did like it wasn't like an age thing

[00:20:04] Justin: no. I mean, I feel like that That hole in the fence has been there since the 60s. Like that's how everyone knew about it. My friend's dad went off to Vietnam and he had sick boards from the 60s. He came back and then he took us to surf there. You're probably the year before.

[00:20:23] Justin: So 89, he knew about the hole in the fence. We went for bagels after that. It was awesome. You're not

[00:20:31] Tyler: No, or, or remember like, you know, even when they were charged, you know, it was five bucks they got on the beach in Long Beach and you just walk by the kids at this stand and you'd be like, they'd be like, you got to pay five bucks. You're like, I know. And you just keep walking and like, no one would do anything.

[00:20:49] Justin: down to the beach as fast as you can. Dude, can I grab your pass for a second? Here's my pass! I told you I had it! They're like, dude, I just, like, No, that's not what happened.

[00:20:59] Tyler: Or [00:21:00] you do the jump off the boardwalk and run, rush to the water. Now they would, cops would tase you and fucking beat the shit out of you like in New Jersey. Yeah. That, well, now it's 20 bucks to get on, so. Something like that.

[00:21:17] Justin: i think it would be hard to get away with the stuff we got away with now

[00:21:23] Tyler: gosh. Yeah. You could never do that.

[00:21:26] Justin: that yeah i don't think you could do a hodeo no

[00:21:30] Tyler: Let me ask, like, do you, like, then when you, you went to like a pretty good university, right?

[00:21:36] Justin: I went, I, uh, went to University of, uh, Wilmington. Wilmington. Yeah.

[00:21:41] Tyler: For business, right? No. No? What

[00:21:44] Justin: no, just general, and, uh I really, there was, I think the year I graduated, Surfer Magazine had the, it was like a list of colleges, like the top ten surf schools, um, and it was east and west coast, [00:22:00] so, and UNCW was on the list, and I think maybe even LIU was on the list, you know, the Southampton

[00:22:08] Tyler: one.

[00:22:08] Justin: like, if you want to freeze your nuts off and kind of

[00:22:11] Tyler: want to

[00:22:12] Justin: Okay, winter surf, that's an option for you. And I was like, man,

[00:22:15] Tyler: come. Yeah, so

[00:22:19] Justin: so you, so Wilmington popped up, it had it, you know, and then there was whatever Flagler or whatever it is in Florida. And, um, I was like, man, I want to, I want to go check it out.

[00:22:29] Justin: Then it looks cool. We went down, uh, my dad drew me down was awesome. Uh, Uh, we got down there and a guy from Boston, like the first minute we drive up, the guy's taking his boogie board out of the car. And I was like, what, what, were you surfing? He's like, yeah, it's pretty fun. And I was like, Dad, we didn't bring boards. And he's like, well, you know, we're doing this mega road trip. Check out all these schools. And I was like, he's like, oh, you want to come check out my room? And I was like, yeah, [00:23:00] totally. We're going to take the tour of the school the next day. And you know, they're like super cool. And he's like. Telling us about everything, and where to go to the beach, and I was just like, my eyes, I was just like, this is awesome.

[00:23:11] Justin: And he's like, and there's a surf club, and I was like, this school has a surf club? And he's like, there's a surf team, and I was like, there's a surf team?! And I was like, Dad! And he's like, and there's Ultimate Frisbee! And I was like, OH MY GOD!

[00:23:23] Tyler: died and got into heaven! I

[00:23:24] Justin: was like, did they play lacrosse? He's like, no. And I was like, PERFECT!

[00:23:27] Tyler: was like, perfect! Oh,

[00:23:32] Justin: So, yeah.

[00:23:34] Tyler: No, I'm just kidding.

[00:23:34] Justin: No, I mean, to each their own. Uh, so yeah, UNCW is awesome. And it was just, like,

[00:23:43] Tyler: I remember you going away to school, and then coming back, and it was like you unlocked a surfing superpower.

[00:23:50] Tyler: And I feel like you progressed. Dramatically in that time frame. Like you were, you know, no offense. You were a decent

[00:23:57] Justin: no, I sucked. I was just a, [00:24:00] for sure, just a beginner. And I went, I remember Going to school and being like, I'm gonna ffff, like, oh sure I may, or

[00:24:09] Tyler: may study.

[00:24:10] Justin: I, yeah, but I'm gonna fucking graduate in surfing and I'm gonna just Latch on to every from the history of it to the competitive aspect of it. Um, and I super lucky to have a great group of peers that were much better surfers, um, and skateboarders too.

[00:24:31] Justin: So, uh, I think the jump off or what made everything change surfing wise was there was a bowl. And Hampstead, just outside of Wilmington, a small bowl, like three and a half feet deep. And so easy to rip. And then right outside of one of the dorms, I think Galloway, was this, we had a red curb.

[00:24:55] Tyler: Mm hmm. Like,

[00:24:56] Justin: Painted like 26 layers of paint on like a [00:25:00] gradual slope and we waxed the hell out of it.

[00:25:02] Justin: And we would like, you, we learned to pump the skateboard and go up and do like these mega slashes and slappies. And like some guys would do like reverts on it. And we

[00:25:13] Tyler: You were surfskating before surfskating became a coaching tool.

[00:25:17] Justin: Ah, yes. I was gay before it was gay.

[00:25:20] Tyler: before it was that. Oh, that's so

[00:25:25] Justin: that's so not politically

[00:25:27] Tyler: Well, we don't mean it in

[00:25:28] Justin: in the way

[00:25:28] Tyler: way that you think it

[00:25:29] Justin: Totally. Not that there's anything wrong with that. No, no. So,

[00:25:33] Tyler: and then, it

[00:25:34] Justin: and then we go down to, so we all the boys go down to Puerto Rico. Yeah. I was like my first surf trip. And I took some fun shapes down there with me and like probably a couple of different years of guys and we're all staying in different places.

[00:25:50] Justin: We're getting together and surf and we're not going to back beers at pools one day. And I was like talking to one of my buddies and I was like, dude, do you see how [00:26:00] reputable that left is at pools? I was like, I could go out on a shortboard and just. Fucking smash that lip and he's like you can't shortboard and I was thinking uh, he's kind of got me on that one I was like, yeah, I definitely have not shortboarded

[00:26:15] Tyler: I've been skateboarding a lot.

[00:26:17] Justin: I'm I'm pretty I've been surfing my balls off.

[00:26:19] Justin: I'm riding this 7 2 really well right now I'm skating a ton and I was like, yeah, let me borrow your board I was like if I if I nail that section you gotta buy beers for everyone tonight And he's like, if you flail, you get to buy beers the rest of the trip.

[00:26:37] Tyler: Oh,

[00:26:38] Justin: I was like, ah, there's only like three days left of the trip.

[00:26:41] Justin: And I was like, but I'm like, I definitely felt like I was feeling it. And I remember, go out, I was like, first wave, didn't really have that section I wanted. Next wave, I got like a little pump, and I came off the bottom. I was like, holy shit, I literally feel like I'm skateboarding right now. And I was like, just look for where you do that [00:27:00] carve in the bowl.

[00:27:01] Justin: Don't even, I just nail it. And, uh, that was it. Bang! Little, like, off the lip, solid little bit of spray, came down with it, stuck it.

[00:27:11] Tyler: Free beers

[00:27:12] Justin: I was like, suck it! I was like, I wanted shots with my beers! So, yeah, and that, that really,

[00:27:19] Tyler: really Oh

[00:27:20] Justin: kind of like, was like a light bulb. Like, oh man, I can, I can shortboard. Um, and then I want to say So that was probably in, like, February of whatever year that was, nine, ninety four, probably, and came home that summer, which was a really good hurricane, 95, 96, were epic hurricane years for us, and, uh,

[00:27:51] Justin: Schultz, John Schultz, gave me, I want to say it was a caster, uh, double wing pin twin fin with the [00:28:00] channel through the bottom. And he's like, you want to try this thing out? I was like, man, this thing looks pretty sick. And it's like super thick, like almost three inches thick, minimal rocker. And it's so funny because I rode those wing pin twin fins with that channel through it.

[00:28:19] Justin: Any old one I would find, a natural art, an MTB, whatever it was, write it till I just killed it. And everyone's like, dude, those words are such shit.

[00:28:31] Tyler: This is, this is Glass Slipper era, too. I mean, anything deviating from, like, High Rock or Potato Chips, like, just no one, no, no, everyone was gonna make fun of

[00:28:43] Justin: to be totally and but me coming from just always riding old, old equipment and never given a fuck what other people thought about my surfing because it wasn't like, Oh, man, I'm out to rip and I'm about to score chicks for my [00:29:00] surfing. I was like, I just want to get a fucking barrel and be left alone.

[00:29:03] Justin: Yeah, I marched to be to my own drummer. Uh, and I just always found that for East Coast. That stubby thick wing pin, uh, with the channel. So you can get a little extra spurt and you, you look at old videos like Greg Mungle and those guys, it just absolutely destroying those boards. Um, and then fast forward, it's 97, 98.

[00:29:30] Justin: I'm at the Ravikakai in Costa Rica. With Toby Smith, and now I have Chronic Keith shaping me those, those Twinfin copies, and we meet Joel Tudor for the first time, and he's like, that board is such a piece of shit, and I was like, I'm fine, but they rep, and now,

[00:29:51] Tyler: Now, look who, look

[00:29:52] Justin: Every single fuckin Shaper's got their wingpin twinfin with at least one channel through it.

[00:29:58] Tyler: Only took around twenty

[00:29:59] Justin: [00:30:00] No, nobody listens to Smokey. Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha

[00:30:05] Tyler: you always had that affinity for like older equipment and, and that type of throwback aesthetic, like even before surfing, like I remember you had longer hair, even from a young age, like you were kind of

[00:30:18] Justin: I think I always, I wouldn't even say hippie, but like, you know, my first

[00:30:23] Tyler: You, you listen to the Grateful Dead and Fish

[00:30:25] Justin: little bit. Yeah. Yeah. No, no. Uh,

[00:30:31] Tyler: it was cool. It

[00:30:32] Justin: sort of. Yeah. Some things you regret more than others. Uh, yeah, but no, I always was into old stuff. So like my. First car when I was 17 was a 54 Dodge and it's like, uh, it's a couple of things.

[00:30:48] Justin: One, they're easy as heck to work on old cars. They don't got computers. They're not, um, two, they're, you can kind of beat the shit out of them. And they still hold [00:31:00] up real well. They're steel, they're well made and it goes the same with, with the older boards, you know, at some point in the nineties, it just him getting it as light as possible, as lightweight as possible, as lightly glass as possible.

[00:31:13] Justin: And it became like. Surfboards were disposable. And I always had like the heavier, I didn't like that. It was like, man, I just dented my brand new whatever. I, I feel like I, I surf kind of heavy footed. So even when I was like at the peak of my shortboarding, I had to go on a high performance, anything. And a lot of, I would just snap those boards, and like, he'd go like, Oh, my buddy, you want to try my board?

[00:31:42] Justin: He's like, dude, you can ride mine. I'm like, Yeah, I'm gonna fucking snap your board in a second. I was like, I'll just let you, I'll just let you try mine. And they're like, dude, did you just, did you just put the biggest dent in my board? And I was like, man, I was just trying to duck dive. I wasn't even a turn.

[00:31:59] Tyler: was [00:32:00] just trying to duck dive. That wasn't even a turn. So I think the

[00:32:10] Justin: So I think the other thing, Yeah. Was that, um,

[00:32:17] Justin: I didn't, I didn't have much, Growing up in Malvern, There was no like, No standout surfer. Or not even in any town close, you know, we have probably, maybe till you get to Oceanside or something like that.

[00:32:32] Tyler: Mike Matcher in Rockville Center. 'cause some could argue, you

[00:32:35] Justin: Totally. Yeah,

[00:32:36] Tyler: a couple RVC guys,

[00:32:37] Justin: I would have been, you know, he would have been younger than me and I was not really in that, in that group.

[00:32:44] Justin: Yeah. So, um, there weren't a lot of surf shops and I guess I stumbled upon Atlantic Beach Surf Shop, Tom

[00:32:54] Tyler: yeah.

[00:32:55] Justin: And this is in the, uh, late [00:33:00] 80s, early 90s, they did VHS, uh, VHS, you could rent a surf movie from them, keep it for a day, keep it for a week, it was the same price, however, just bring it back, and Yes, you're watching some Sarge's flicks and then all of a sudden I was like, man, look at all the Bruce Brown films you have, like, man, let me get into this, and I'm just watching all these old surf movies and I'm like, oh man, like this guy, he catches all the waves, he double arm paddles, I'm gonna start double arm paddling, and then I get to Wilmington and they're like, what's with the fucking double arm paddle?

[00:33:35] Justin: I was like, Man, Robert August did an endless summary, it worked, and they're like, what are you talking about? I was like, double arm paddle. I was like, I don't know. Is that, is that not how you do it? And they're like, no, you cook. And I was like, all right. I was like, so wait, what are you saying? It's one. Yeah.

[00:33:50] Justin: Yeah. All right. Yeah. Whatever. But I think that, so watching all those old surf movies and really. [00:34:00] Realizing that style is just as important as like,

[00:34:07] Justin: yeah. You mean, think about how many people we could talk about who were like, Oh, they could like, remember that person could stick an air and then you're like, but I fucking hated to watch him surf.

[00:34:16] Tyler: No, no, no, no, no names, but there were people who could do all the maneuvers but couldn't, couldn't just look awful, you know. Especially, it became such a problem with people from like the 90s, who grew up surfing in the 90s because they went straight on to like a potato chip to learn and then they overcompensated and got a poo man stance, you know.

[00:34:39] Justin: Or how many guys just rolled down the window to get going.

[00:34:42] Tyler: Yeah.

[00:34:42] Justin: Just a wind in the back corner.

[00:34:45] Tyler: I still do pet the cat. Oh, you do? Oh, I'm a, I'm a cat petter. I mean, I have, I have cats now, too. So I really have gotten good at it, you know?

[00:34:53] Justin: you, you've perfected the skill

[00:34:54] Tyler: but that's a, that's a Charles Bernowitz influence.

[00:34:57] Justin: Mm hmm.

[00:34:59] Justin: [00:35:00] Absolutely.

[00:35:00] Tyler: For our listeners, Charles Bernowitz is a legendary Long Beach ripper.

[00:35:04] Justin: longboard, everything. Definitely one of the guys, you know, that I grew up with. Style and performance. And then,

[00:35:14] Tyler: He was like our Fonz. Like, to me. He was like, he would rock up, like, from his job, white t shirt, jeans, you know, cuff, you know, cuffs on the pants.

[00:35:24] Justin: just finishing off the garbage truck. Yeah. You are. Like he was, um, what the hell was that? He was

[00:35:29] Tyler: air conditioner, he repairs well, he did, and like,

[00:35:33] Justin: I remember the Charlie Sheen, um, Amelia Estevez

[00:35:37] Tyler: oh yeah, yeah, yeah. That was Charlotte.

[00:35:39] Justin: That was Charlie, just. The come with his coveralls to the beach. Yeah, man at work.

[00:35:44] Justin: Yeah, come to the coveralls with his beach and his board and you're like, oh man, get out of the water. He's going to put a show on and his nephew. I'll ripped. Yeah,

[00:35:54] Tyler: Who moved to [00:36:00] Wilmington. Yeah. He's

[00:36:03] Justin: He's friends with, with all the guys that I went to school with.

[00:36:06] Justin: Yeah. He's part of that circle for sure. Now they're all like. Crazy waterman into everything.

[00:36:13] Tyler: that circle.

[00:36:26] Tyler: Kind of do whatever, like, cause you, you kind of went into finance and

[00:36:30] Justin: yeah, well, let's

[00:36:32] Tyler: give us, give us the, the, the career trajectory

[00:36:35] Justin: So got left Wilmington, went to Costa Rica. For four months with a couple of my buddies came back, had no idea what I was going to do. Uh, got a job selling glass out of Red Hook, Brooklyn that my dad helped me out with.

[00:36:52] Justin: Like kind of glass like this for studio spaces and architectural.

[00:36:57] Tyler: so you would enter interact with now flip then, [00:37:00] you

[00:37:00] Justin: A little bit. I don't think I, yeah, I think my interactions with him were on, not of that sort, but, uh, it, uh, it didn't work out and I was, I was competing, like I was competing doing the, like the, the long board and the short and some short board stuff with like the unsounds and then I got invited to do the Red Bull cold waters and all that.

[00:37:27] Tyler: When did that come to become a realization for you? Like, oh, I can kind of compete on like a higher level.

[00:37:33] Justin: don't, I. I

[00:37:39] Justin: could do five turns. I was like, where was just, I could, I could see that all of a sudden I could link up turns and I would be watching other people who said they surf competitively and I felt like I surfed to their level sometimes a little bit better. Um, And it was fun [00:38:00] for me to kind of stick it to everyone and stay true to myself and just ride the equipment I wanted to ride and go do it in a quote unquote, you know, pro whatever, or an East Coast pro contest, pro am, sure.

[00:38:16] Justin: And, um, yeah, that was at that same time, that's when Tom Curran was getting Off of short boards and more riding everything else. And I felt like that was like a little, okay. I'm not, I'm not like the only one who thinks like there's more to surfboards than just like your six foot thruster.

[00:38:36] Tyler: it's funny, like, collectively, the surf world kinda started circling back around to that equipment, right? Like, you have Curran, Derek Hind, you have Kidman, Litmus, then you have Thomas Campbell, Joel, you know, it's like, interesting how all that kinda, around the same time.

[00:38:53] Justin: Yeah. What was that? Seedling? No, the woman in Australia. The one.

[00:38:57] Tyler: It's Litmus.

[00:38:58] Justin: Uh, uh, [00:39:00] Slater, Joel Tudor, and all them are staying in the house

[00:39:03] Tyler: Oh, Shelter. Yeah.

[00:39:05] Justin: And you're just like, okay, I get it. Here's, like, here's Donovan, and he can go blow out that 6 0, and then he's gonna go ride a 6 7 and do the most butter bottom turn.

[00:39:17] Justin: And you're like, alright, which is better? That bottom turn he just did that was, like, steezy and set up a perfect barrel? Or that one turn that there just, there was no wave left. He just pumped and pumped and pumped and just bang. And you're like, well, I like to draw out a better, I want to draw out a better line.

[00:39:35] Justin: And I want to, I want to do a clean. I don't want, you know, um, and I don't need to make it look all spazzy. And if it'll win me a something, it'll win me a something. And, or maybe it gets me a little, I, I don't even know. Yeah, because I wasn't seeking like a ton of recognition, I just wanted to stick it to everyone and be like, you know, I can totally spank [00:40:00] you on a wing pin, twin fin that you're just going to be like angry and cursing everything.

[00:40:07] Justin: And I remember one, one of the finals. Semi finals of one of the unsound pros.

[00:40:17] Justin: I'm kind of awestruck who I like drew. And it's like Dean Randazzo and some

[00:40:25] Tyler: Adam Veers,

[00:40:26] Justin: some guy I had drawn him. Yeah. And, uh, maybe Danny Milhoto

[00:40:33] Tyler: Mel Hato. Wow. That's a name.

[00:40:35] Justin: um, And like, we're all standing around and like, we're getting our jerseys or something. And Dean turns to Danny and he's like, Who the fuck is

[00:40:44] Tyler: Justin Schwartz.

[00:40:44] Justin: Schwartz? And I'm like, I look over and I'm like, That'd be me.

[00:40:49] Tyler: would be me. I'm just gonna pat it out on my shingle fin here.

[00:40:54] Justin: like my twin fin?

[00:40:55] Tyler: It says

[00:40:56] Justin: It says fuck on one side of the fin and you on the other. [00:41:00] Cause if you don't like it, well, there you go. And uh, yeah. And I cupped. I just held to it, so Sometimes it would work in my favor, and other times, like, I remember a Red Bull, one of the Red Bull, where you got to go, yeah, you got to go to Nova Scotia, and uh, it was down in Jersey, and I made it to the final, and it was like the top two guys go.

[00:41:27] Justin: And I paddled out on my longboard in the final.

[00:41:30] Tyler: they must have

[00:41:31] Justin: and Jack was like, what the fuck are you doing? And I was like, dude, it went from eight foot this morning to it's like two foot and just like mediocre at best. I was like, I know this is supposed to be a big wave whatever, but there's no rule. And he was like, Justin, don't do it.

[00:41:49] Justin: And I was like, I fucking, I don't care.

[00:41:52] Tyler: You're like, if Dave Parmenter can do it in the OP Pro, I could do it here. And I,

[00:41:56] Justin: And I just, I didn't care, you know, and I was like, this is the right board for [00:42:00] the wave, period. And then like halfway through, I went, got the twin fin, and caught like five more waves on the twin fin, and he's like, no way.

[00:42:08] Justin: I was like, no way what? He's like, I'm just not, you know, you're not going. And I was like, dude, you're telling me I didn't come in at least second. He said, I'm telling you, you're not going. And I was like, all right, all right. So, you know, sometimes it was either a good one or it just bit you in the ass.

[00:42:26] Tyler: do you, did you feel like outside of like that inner surf clique, you know, like of the, the Alberts, the Larrys, the Charles, like all the really good surfers. And then you're kind of like riding something totally different. Did you feel like that there was a resistance to what you were doing and would you get a lot of shit?

[00:42:47] Justin: me, hated me.

[00:42:49] Tyler: wasn't because you back paddled?

[00:42:51] Justin: Uh, yeah, probably that too, but I mean, God, I don't know how long Larry and I hated each other for, I mean, I did, like, I [00:43:00] would, if I saw him, I'd see him with Eric, Eric Aiken, the same way, uh, and it just was, it was, I ate a lot of fucking crow, you know, and just, I think the only one of that, of that group, so that'd be like the Lido Surf and Sport Sensations.

[00:43:21] Justin: Yes. So we'll call it that. Yes.

[00:43:24] Tyler: sea level too.

[00:43:26] Justin: And so like, I, you know, this would be before I even learned how to surf, I'd go to Sensations in Oceanside. I'd be like, Oh my God. Like, there's Gary. He looks so fucking cool with his long hair and I, man, I bet he must, he must like. Whatever, and so, of that whole group, I would, I think the only two that were accepting of it right away were, uh, Brian Walsh and Dave Wan.

[00:43:53] Tyler: Yeah. Interesting. Dave, I'm

[00:43:56] Justin: never, did never, he's just like, well fuck, if you [00:44:00] surf good, you surf good. That's it, I don't get, your boards are stupid,

[00:44:04] Tyler: Cause I've never seen Dave on anything other than a short board, you know?

[00:44:08] Justin: But he's got a sick, he, but he appreciates the history of surfing and he's got a sick collection of boards that he doesn't really talk

[00:44:15] Tyler: He also has a sick comic book

[00:44:17] Justin: He

[00:44:18] Tyler: Oh, it's awesome.

[00:44:20] Justin: That, that he'll, that he'll talk your ear off about.

[00:44:22] Tyler: been trying, I've been trying, man.

[00:44:24] Justin: Yeah. So, I think, um, you had the old crew in Long Beach who would ride anything.

[00:44:31] Tyler: Yeah.

[00:44:32] Justin: And then you had the guys who were just a little bit older than me who would only ride just the thrust, you know, high performance thrusters.

[00:44:40] Tyler: Tynan, Chris Fay, Charles Bernowich. Like, just, just dropping some names here for you.

[00:44:46] Justin: totally. I mean, there's so many. Yeah. Uh, Doug.

[00:44:50] Tyler: Oh man, Doug Sutermeister, yeah. Yeah.

[00:44:52] Justin: And then you had guys like Kevin Simes, who was like, Oh man, that guy's a little older than me, and he's sticking to [00:45:00] the old school logs and not giving a shit. Um, and then As I got a little bit older, Danny McDonough and Jay and all them, Larry all started writing proper logs and you could see like, all right, this is, things are changing and you could see it in the lineup too.

[00:45:21] Justin: It just, I think at a certain point, We all realize we're not gonna ride Kelly Slater. Elf sticks. Yeah. On east, on East Coast. This doesn't happen. And then the, the one day that it is good enough for a board like that, you're like, how the, how do I make this board work instead of like being on a board that you could ride from one foot to six foot.

[00:45:46] Justin: Totally. Yeah.

[00:45:47] Tyler: So how'd you get invited to the rabbit cake? I event in Costa Rica. Like that, that's crazy.

[00:45:53] Justin: don't even know

[00:45:55] Tyler: Like,

[00:45:55] Justin: actually, I used Toby and I, um. [00:46:00] No, I couldn't even tell you. And I remember Toby being like, We're, we're doing this. And I was like, we are?

[00:46:07] Tyler: Yeah, like the only ones from New York representing at the time. Yeah. Not even Tony Caramonico went to that at the time, I think, no?

[00:46:14] Justin: he was at the Greg

[00:46:16] Tyler: Yeah, the Gregg

[00:46:16] Justin: at the same, it was at Boca Branca as well.

[00:46:19] Justin: That was like three years before. Um, I wanna, it was Toby, myself, and I wanted to say Mikey DeTemple, but at that point he was living in Florida. Yeah,

[00:46:31] Tyler: he wasn't a real proper, he was born in New

[00:46:33] Justin: was born in New York, but we all know you're from Florida,

[00:46:36] Tyler: live in Florida,

[00:46:37] Justin: Uh, no, much love for Mike. Uh, but yeah, I remember, and he would have been so much, you know, so much younger than

[00:46:43] Tyler: Yeah.

[00:46:44] Justin: Uh, and it was Given my affinity for the history of surfing to go down to that contest when everyone Every 60s surfer every surfer that you grew up with [00:47:00] you all these fucking movies that I'd watch growing up From Rabbi Kikai to Corky Carroll to Greg Null

[00:47:06] Tyler: August . Everybody.

[00:47:08] Justin: everybody. And it was so cool because it was, it was, yeah, it was a competition, but like, after the competition, Robert August would be like, you want to come and have dinner with us?

[00:47:19] Justin: And I'm like, oh my God. And it'd be like everyone, everyone, you know, um, and then learning, you know, like LJ Richards is like Adele Dobson and they're all competing and. murdering it and you're like, fuck, I'm going to get put out by some old fuck. I'm not, I'm not even going to make it through heat because I didn't realize these legends are here and how hard they rep and like Bill and shapers to Bill Stewart was, you know, Bill Stewart was, uh, Takayama was there with Joel and, um, Yeah, it was an amazing, amazing experience.

[00:47:56] Justin: And there were guys, any who's [00:48:00] who of longboard surfing from that era was at that contest. Yeah. Like the Japanese guys, the Australian guys, the guys from Hawaii, Bunga Perkins was staying in the room next to us with Dino Miranda. And like, yeah, it was, it was fucking awesome. And, we're walking down the hallway, it's Toby and I, and we're kind of, we walk into our room, and oh my god, Joel Tudor passes us, and he's with uh, Josh Baxter. And I just

[00:48:31] Tyler: love his

[00:48:32] Justin: dude, I look at Toby and I kind of fucking give him an elbow. And like Joel turns to Josh and he's like, yo, did you hear these guys from New York brought a bong down with them? And I look at Toby and I'm almost like, dude, that's us. This is, this is. And Toby goes, that's us. And they're like, oh dude, we'll be in your room in five minutes.

[00:48:54] Justin: And that was it. That's like, and that's

[00:48:55] Tyler: how you became good friends with Joel

[00:48:56] Justin: Yeah. Lifelong friendships. Totally I that, [00:49:00] and it's so funny 'cause. In traveling, Toby or myself, we'll run into those guys. And, we always still laugh about sitting in that room the first time, and it's like, three dudes from Australia, a guy from France, this guy from Japan who's like eight foot tall, all these dudes from California, and we probably stayed in the room for like five hours, just talking story, laughing our asses off.

[00:49:23] Justin: It was, yeah, that's how you make lifelong friends.

[00:49:26] Tyler: must have learned so much, like, about surf history by just sheer osmosis being around it for those types of events.

[00:49:35] Justin: And, and, and like I said, when the opportunity came, Toby and I get invited to go have dinner with someone, and you knew, like, oh, they're just gonna talk story all night. And you just sit there, keep your mouth shut, just, oh, is that really how it, like you, No, let me tell you how it actually happened, cause that's total bullshit.

[00:49:54] Justin: And I think

[00:49:55] Tyler: We didn't really discover Cape St. Francis,

[00:49:58] Justin: You know, let me tell you how it [00:50:00] played out in the movie, versus how long we actually sat there and waited for that fucking wave to And so, I think All the back history is, is so interesting and, um, I try to make myself like an encyclopedia of the history of surfing, like, like Matt Warshaw.

[00:50:20] Justin: I could, I've read that fricking, it's like, encyclopedia of surfing, I've read it back and forth and like waited for him to update it, like knowing the first one, like reading it and going, that's not

[00:50:31] Tyler: Yeah.

[00:50:32] Justin: I know. I don't know how to reach this guy to tell him, but I already know, matter of fact, that that is not correct.

[00:50:39] Justin: And then, like, the updated version, and you'd see the, like, something removed from it, and you're like, told ya. Ha ha ha ha

[00:50:47] Tyler: when you're like, I just got one over on the encyclopedia.

[00:50:51] Justin: know the

[00:50:52] Tyler: Yeah. Or,

[00:50:55] Justin: certain logos come about or how businesses were formed or [00:51:00] whatever,

[00:51:00] Tyler: fell apart. Those are the best stories.

[00:51:03] Justin: for sure. I, you know, the Tom Parish is a perfect example of that.

[00:51:08] Tyler: Yeah. Give, give our listeners a little bit. Like I'm, I'm very familiar with his story and his history, but it's, it is, I'm curious, like your, your perspective on that

[00:51:17] Justin: I mean, the long story short of. In addition to Tom being like one of the best shapers ever, you know, the lightning bolt guy, Jeff Hackman's, you know, him and Tom made the most amazing sunset.

[00:51:34] Tyler: Mm hmm. Mm

[00:51:38] Justin: um, Tom was original investor in Quicksilver, Hawaii, um, and ended up getting fucked big time.

[00:51:51] Justin: And like he had, he, the contract was pretty cut and dry. And even with that, they were like, yo, you're fucked. You're out. It doesn't [00:52:00] matter what the contract says you were this is what we're doing and he's like get better fucking I have a contract with you guys and that made him go to law school

[00:52:08] Tyler: and he became a lawyer.

[00:52:09] Justin: he became a lawyer to be like I'm never gonna fucking let that happen again

[00:52:14] Tyler: putting myself in that position again.

[00:52:16] Justin: totally and it's a great, you know, it's I've in addition to getting boards from Tom You know become great friends with him.

[00:52:23] Justin: So you get to hear again. I love the backstories and like oh man Let me tell you about like How this happened, or how that happened. And there's always these, you know, how a board design came about, or how a fin ended up here, or a wing ended up there, and, um, you know, either, I dropped a board, and I had to fucking, I couldn't, I couldn't undrop it, so now I'm like, cutting the wing out, like, way far forward than I wanted to, and I'm like, I gotta go with it, and if not, we'll do it again tomorrow.

[00:52:52] Justin: Um, yeah, and, to, I went, I was competing.

[00:52:58] Tyler: How'd you, how'd you place in that [00:53:00] contest? You made it pretty far, no? No, I

[00:53:02] Justin: I think I, the farthest I only made it, I think that, I only made it through a few rounds. Toby did really, Toby did really well, but yeah. Which is

[00:53:09] Tyler: because when we grew up surfing together, like, he was just a full on shortboard, you know, ripper. And then all of a sudden I remember seeing his name at that concert. I'm like, Toby Longboards? And now he's like

[00:53:20] Justin: and it was, it was funny, because, Certainly for the first round of that contest, A high, if you, you either were, Completely traditional, or you were surfing off the tail, high performances, like crazy shortboard ripping. And so I remember it was Toby and this guy from Venezuela were both high performance, like surfing monkeys, super wide stands with big floaters and occasional cross step, but like lots of radical cutbacks.

[00:53:52] Justin: And then you had Joel and maybe Kevin Connolly who were. Just like tip time [00:54:00] masters. And you're like, wow, this is,

[00:54:03] Tyler: quite to contrast. Yeah. You

[00:54:04] Justin: we're just going to go one or two directions, you know, over the next few years, um, unfortunately what more in the high performance direction, you know, through the early two thousands, but it was so cool to see.

[00:54:17] Justin: Um, and then after doing all the contests locally and whatever else, uh, I got sponsored by local motion or Hawaiian style, whichever it was. And I want to go to Hawaii. I want to go to Hawaii. I want to see what a real, like what a real wave is like. I want to push myself. Um, I had no interest in competing.

[00:54:43] Justin: I just wanted to go and scare the shit out of myself. I, and it felt like you needed a real. A real proving ground. Um, or I felt like I did. I don't know. To each their own. I, so, [00:55:00] I, my first trip to Hawaii, I went with Chronic Keith. Uh, Ollie.

[00:55:06] Tyler: Oh, Ollie. Avada, man. Um,

[00:55:09] Justin: and Matt. I forgot Matt's last name. And they were there for a couple weeks when I got there.

[00:55:19] Justin: I had brought a few, like, kind of gunnier, you know, ready, whatever. I had no idea. And it's like a four foot day at Log Cabins. Uh, it's like one of my first sessions. And I don't, it looks so heavy. And there's nobody out. And, um, John Dana, uh, pulls up. You know John? Yeah. Yeah. So he's out there with Big Brian.

[00:55:49] Justin: And, and they just randomly show up at, at Logs. Is that who

[00:55:51] Tyler: Brian Surratt?

[00:55:53] Justin: Uh, no. Brian, um, Moku Brian. Okay. Yeah, from New York.

[00:55:57] Tyler: Okay, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, sorry. [00:56:00] Um,

[00:56:00] Justin: So they roll up

[00:56:02] Tyler: Owens and

[00:56:03] Justin: I'm like, you guys going out? No. And I was like, no. And John's like, come here. And he walks me down to the sand, like, right where And he puts his arm around me.

[00:56:14] Justin: And he's like, you don't have to go out. And I was like, no. He's like, no. And I'm like, go back to New York. I'll tell everyone what a fucking pussy you are. Just like Keith, Ali, and Matt. And he's like, or, fucking put your big boy pants on and fucking paddle out. He's like, what's the worst that can happen? I was like, I'd die.

[00:56:31] Tyler: like,

[00:56:32] Justin: And so,

[00:56:33] Tyler: die.

[00:56:34] Justin: like, I caught like a little shoulder and I made it. I don't know, I was like, oh, okay, I think I, I think I can do this. I had a next wave, I wanted to be a little deeper, I paddle, I paddle, I paddle, I get sucked over the falls, slam sideways, and perforate my eardrum. And I was like, well, now I'm out.

[00:56:54] Justin: I'm like, out, out. And John felt so bad. Like, uh, yeah, he [00:57:00] knew, he was like, I fuckin just,

[00:57:01] Tyler: it's like, I

[00:57:01] Justin: I, I just, I ruined this. I ruined this so bad for Justin. And, uh, the next day, he's like, so like, what do they say? I was like, they say, like, at least two weeks out of the water, at least. And I'm like, I, I could pop my nose, and like, blow a bong head out of my ear.

[00:57:18] Justin: That's how, it was like, there was a massive hole in my ear. It wasn't just like a little

[00:57:23] Tyler: heard that. I've heard that

[00:57:25] Justin: yeah, it was, it could like whistle, like play different like songs out of it. And um, yeah so he, he felt bad and the next day he's like, Hey, I want to introduce you to someone.

[00:57:39] Justin: And he's like, it would just feel awful. And he's like, do you fish? And I was like, nope. I was like, all right, well, we're going to introduce you to Perry Dane. And I was

[00:57:48] Tyler: to ask how you met

[00:57:49] Justin: I was like, all right, I think I know that name. And I'm like, all right. Oh man. I think Perry serves for locomotion. And I'm like, all right.

[00:57:58] Justin: So now I'm like, look through the [00:58:00] catalog and I see a picture. And I was like, oh man. This guy is scary as hell

[00:58:05] Tyler: Tell our listeners how terrifying Perry Dayne can

[00:58:09] Justin: He is so he's huge he's an incredible surfer and he's just so intimidating You know him and Johnny boy just regulated the you know from the 90s through the mid to you know something like that. Um, I worked for Cito when I was in college And had been on boats, knew I didn't get seasick. And he's like, if you don't get seasick, you're good.

[00:58:37] Justin: And he's like, are you sure? He's like, cause it's really, really rocket. And I was like, nope, good to go. And, um, yeah, that started a great relationship with Perry. Um, I was a terrible fisherman. But, you know, I definitely learned a lot. We fished primarily tuna and mahi. Um, it was just the two of us on the boat almost all the time.

[00:58:58] Tyler: what was he like? [00:59:00] is he a man of many words or

[00:59:02] Justin: Some? Depends.

[00:59:03] Tyler: Would he open up emotionally to you?

[00:59:05] Justin: to you? You

[00:59:07] Tyler: You don't have to share his secrets, so just

[00:59:09] Justin: saying. No, I, yeah, I mean, some things I definitely can't even, I wouldn't even begin to say, uh, yeah, uh, yeah, um, but yeah, he would definitely open up about things and tell, you know, cause you're just like, you gotta stay awake.

[00:59:23] Justin: You're leaving the, you're leaving Haleiwa Harbor at 3am for the sun to come up at 6am, so you have three hours in the dark, you're looking for turtles on the bow of the boat, you're trying to stay awake, so you're just talking about, Anything. Anything and everything. I'd be like, oh, did I ever tell you about this?

[00:59:42] Justin: Did you want me to tell you what my dog did last night? Hey, can you tell me something? Tell me anything, Justin. Just tell me something. Oh, okay. He's like, that's an awful story.

[00:59:52] Tyler: we got these great bagels.

[00:59:54] Justin: I brought, man, bring in bagels and, uh, pork cooked pizza. So like three quarter [01:00:00] cooked, so you'd finish it off once you got to Hawaii.

[01:00:02] Justin: Yeah, those were the days you could, I, this was pre nine 11, so you could bring whatever you pretty much could bring whatever you wanted on the plane with you or without you.

[01:00:17] Tyler: That's

[01:00:17] Justin: And that's all I'll say about that.

[01:00:18] Tyler: then, you, you left and then went back to Hawaii? Like, what happened in between? Because you ended up living there for a couple years,

[01:00:27] Justin: Yup. I was there until, uh, yeah, I was there a couple of years. I worked at Hollywood Joe's washing dishes, which was epic. Joe was our, is the owner there. He epic charger. And you'd have guys like Dave Cantrell was a waiter and you're just like, damn. Legend. He's like, hey, you want to come surf Rocky Point with me?

[01:00:53] Justin: I'm like, absolutely. Do I? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And you, you know, Kelly Slater come in and sit at the [01:01:00] bar or whatever. You'd like, uh, God, I remember, um, fast Eddie coming in the kitchen one day and just taking food. And I'm like, who the fuck is this guy? And they're like, don't, don't ever, you just let him do.

[01:01:15] Tyler: him take what he wants.

[01:01:16] Justin: All right. And yeah, you just like, you saw the front of the house and back of the house and how different people got treated different, uh, certain pros were like treated like gods and other pros were like, I think if you want to shit in his food, go right.

[01:01:31] Tyler: Here's Ian Cairns spitting his food. My, my brother worked at the, the health food place, you know, in like, uh, 98, 99. And I remember he would like, Uh, Slater would come in and order, like, the hummus plate and then wouldn't finish it and my brother would be like, Maybe there's, like, superpowers in this hummus.

[01:01:53] Tyler: And he would eat, like, the leftovers, basically, of

[01:01:56] Justin: Slater, did he get it?

[01:01:57] Tyler: Definitely

[01:01:58] Justin: nothing.

[01:01:59] Tyler: not. [01:02:00] Definitely not.

[01:02:01] Justin: he have hair?

[01:02:01] Tyler: He is losing it.

[01:02:03] Justin: maybe he got that from Slater. . He

[01:02:07] Tyler: He did get yelled at by Poncho Sullivan once. He thought, he thought, uh, he was out, he had like a Bobby Owens Patagonia gun, you know, back in like the late 90s when he was doing it, and he's surfing Sunset, and he got a wave and he didn't see anyone behind him or anything.

[01:02:24] Tyler: And he's sitting there and he sees Poncho paddling up to him, and he's like, Poncho is paddling up to me! Maybe he wants to talk to me about my board or something! And then he's like, I think you dropped in on me on that. And he's like, No, I don't think I did. And he's like, Yeah, I think you did. And he's just like, Oh shit, I just Poncho.

[01:02:38] Tyler: Yeah!

[01:02:39] Justin: Yeah, some of those guys are just, you know, I'm small.

[01:02:42] Justin: So it was always so intimidating.

[01:02:45] Tyler: But you worked very well in between. Like, you were able to kind of finagle. You

[01:02:49] Justin: totally. I think being hooked up with Perry was a godsend because if he said, Hey, you want to come surf is just, you know, you [01:03:00] pick off pretty much, you pick off whatever wave you want. He'd tell you which ones to go. You're, if he's telling you to go, Hey, you're, you better fucking go and everyone else's.

[01:03:10] Justin: It's everyone else will hold back because I told him to go don't fucking don't you go on him And like a lot of he would always look period always look for the rights So I knew like if I just sat to next to him paddled just a little bit deeper And people will be like, you don't paddle deeper than Perry, he will fucking kill you.

[01:03:31] Justin: And Perry will be like, Shebe, where are you going right now? I'm like,

[01:03:34] Tyler: I'm going

[01:03:35] Justin: going left.

[01:03:36] Tyler: I'm going left not right. He's

[01:03:37] Justin: you better not look at that right, do what you're doing. I was like, no, I promise, I promise, I just go left. So, yeah, I, you know, I fell asleep at V Land, or at Rocky Point, that was, oh, you know there's certain waves where the left was just as good as the right, but everyone always, for some reason, eyed the right, and you're like, man,

[01:03:57] Tyler: Be like, I'm going to backyards, you can have

[01:03:59] Justin: totally, [01:04:00] exactly,

[01:04:01] Tyler: Um, so we met in Hawaii again. And it was funny, like it was super coincidence. Like I was in strong current, I think. And all of a sudden I see Justin walk in with just road rash all up and down the side of his body.

[01:04:19] Tyler: And I'm like, yeah, really? Is that who did

[01:04:22] Justin: No, no, it was the um, Uh, remember

[01:04:26] Tyler: Carve

[01:04:26] Justin: the carver, whatever it was. So, he was out there with his dad. And dropped off one of the car to demo. And, um, like it had sat in the shop for probably a month or so. And he came in the shop and he's like, like, did anyone try it?

[01:04:44] Justin: Or like, like the board weighs like 90 pounds. It's super weird. Like you try to ride it on flat ground and it doesn't do anything. You can't pump it. And, uh, He's like, well, I'll take the board. I'm going to take the board back.

[01:04:58] Tyler: Yeah. And I

[01:04:59] Justin: And I was like, [01:05:00] whoa, wait.

[01:05:01] Tyler: lemme, lemme try it, lemme

[01:05:02] Justin: So we get it up. We go up top, we go to Pupukea and like all the way up at the top.

[01:05:08] Justin: And the first run was just a short run. I'm like, man, you could take it on the dirt. You can kind of

[01:05:14] Tyler: cause it had in big inflatable

[01:05:16] Justin: So you're like, all right, if I'm going a little too fast and go up on the lawn, do a little slash, I'll come back on to the pavement and I'm going. I go in kind of where the, you're making the huge turn to go towards food land.

[01:05:32] Justin: So where the, but where, where you're bombing and I'm like, uh, this is where I'm going to stop. And I know I need like the clearance to get up on the lawn on the other side before I go to bomb it. And a car comes up, come in the opposite direction. I'm like, Oh shit, I can't, I can't turn. And I'm like, all right, let me, it's like, this is my old shit face and fuck.

[01:05:58] Justin: And [01:06:00] so in addition to having those big rubber slick tires, it was spring

[01:06:05] Tyler: I

[01:06:06] Justin: The trucks, the trucks were spring loaded. So I said, all right, let me try to like slide and give it a little slide and see if I can slow myself down. Hey, I want to stop. I don't want, I don't want to try to bomb. I know I'm not good enough.

[01:06:20] Justin: And, uh, I try to like slide it out and the thing torques me with the springs and I go from sliding and it just. throws me over the other side. My buddies are behind me videotaping. Cause we want to show Brad, like all that, that we filmed the, uh, Clark Duncan Campbell,

[01:06:41] Tyler: like, I watched

[01:06:43] Justin: that. And this was, you know, back then he's like, we watched that like 30, 000 times.

[01:06:48] Justin: Just, you know, I, so I go off the front, I go over the. I go from heel side to get dumped toe edge and I hit so hard that I bounce off the [01:07:00] asphalt and I go up like seven feet in the air. I still have all my clothes intact at that point. And then I hit again, and as soon as I hit, it just ripped the shirt, like, ripped it right off of me.

[01:07:13] Justin: And I bounce again, I fall down again, boom, board shorts, fuckin shorts, right off of me. And now I'm naked,

[01:07:21] Tyler: naked. Covered head

[01:07:22] Justin: head to toe, and just the worst road rash ever. And I'm going into like, a week before my 25th birthday or something like that. And yeah, just like, Totally fucked up. And yeah, that's probably right.

[01:07:35] Justin: That's what I saw you.

[01:07:36] Tyler: saw you. And then

[01:07:38] Justin: And then a

[01:07:39] Tyler: A few weeks later, or a month later, you're swimming, you're, you're surfing off, uh, I think the west side, not even month, you're surfing on the west side, we won't say where, and, uh, a boat runs you over.

[01:07:54] Tyler: Yeah. That

[01:07:57] Justin: That happened. So this, yeah. [01:08:00] Oh, we're surfing early. So there's a south swell, so it's July, end of July, I'd say it was July 22nd.

[01:08:08] Justin: Um, but we're surfing, the four of us, and we're paddling out. A was solid, like six foot south swell. And the wave, given the size, it breaks pretty far off the beach. So you can kinda see it, but it's, you know, dawn, and we're paddling out. And I think, preface this with the year prior, Al Prisco, was on a boat, going through, uh, Point Lookout, Jones Inlet. And he was on the bow of the boat, hit some chop, and he fell off the bow of the boat, and got run over by the boat.

[01:08:46] Tyler: remember

[01:08:47] Justin: And he got tangled up in the prop, and got ffffucked up, like near death. You know, just,

[01:08:53] Tyler: he didn't surf for

[01:08:54] Justin: Oh yeah, no, he, you know, like, chunks out of his bones, like, really, really. And I remember thinking like, [01:09:00] Goddammit, how do you, like, not try to dive under the boat?

[01:09:04] Justin: And obviously in the instance, like, you know, you're thinking like, dude, I would have done this and I would have done that. And, but obviously, you know, in the instant that it happens, you don't, you know, you may not know anything. So, with that in mind, now we're surfing, we're way outside. And we're kind of like paddling out of like a square.

[01:09:24] Justin: And I'd be like the bottom left corner of the square. So, two of us in the back, two of us are in the front. Uh, we're probably three quarters of the way out and you faintly hear this boing, boing, boing, boing, boing, boing, boing. And I'm like, yeah, I haven't worked on a fishing boat already. And I'm like thinking, is that sounds like a boat coming through the lineup, but no way, because this, the surf's solid.

[01:09:51] Justin: And now you can see the guy and we're, we're not far [01:10:00] from the fishing harbor.

[01:10:00] Tyler: yeah.

[01:10:02] Justin: And in his mind, it's Ass Crocodon, there's not going to be anyone in the water, and a surfer wave to the harbor. And, like, he's coming, he's coming, and like, as he's getting closer to us, I'm starting to think there's no, he's got to see us, like he's got to see the two guys in front.

[01:10:24] Justin: He's got to see them. There's no way he's going to keep coming this way, and miraculously he goes between Jay and Campbell

[01:10:36] Tyler: yeah.

[01:10:37] Justin: and So they're on the front and as soon as he goes between them So say there's like 20 feet apart 30 feet apart between the two of them as soon as he realizes Holy shit, there's surfers in the water.

[01:10:50] Justin: He just turns the boat super hard To the beach to kind of go to kind of go back out the lineup to like reset and get up [01:11:00] farther outside and yeah, now there's probably from that turn like about 40 feet of distance and he's, you know, he turns it. He doesn't see the, uh, that, uh, Eric or I, uh, Alex, excuse me, Captain Alex.

[01:11:17] Justin: Was that

[01:11:18] Tyler: mm-hmm

[01:11:18] Justin: Right? He doesn't see the two of us and he guns it right at me. And I'm like, Oh mother motherfucking God. Like this is. This, all that shit is about to happen right now. And I first fucking take my leash off and I was like take my leash off. I got the leash off I pushed the board away from me and I'm like, is he gonna come right at me?

[01:11:42] Justin: Is he gonna hit the board? And this is all in like a split second. Oh my god. He's yep He's at he's coming at me and I'm like, all right, you gotta clear the, you gotta clear the boat You gotta dive as deep and as fast as you can like Like you never [01:12:00] got deeper in your whole life. And I dove and I got under, I can feel the boat coming over my back and I'm like, all right, here we go.

[01:12:09] Justin: Like, you know, the prop's going to come next. And I feel like I'm, I'm pretty deep and I gave it one more kick down to clear it. And I. Yeah, that's I kicked my foot and I kicked the propeller and he took and he just kept he I came up and I was like yelled for him to stop and I scream and like, Oh, I'm done.

[01:12:30] Justin: And he looked back and just kept going

[01:12:32] Tyler: that's not how it's

[01:12:35] Justin: no, no.

[01:12:36] Tyler: go.

[01:12:37] Justin: Um,

[01:12:38] Tyler: it cuts.

[01:12:40] Justin: guys knew who it was. And they're like, don't even this is this is the west side. It's like it's that's not that's not how this is going to happen. Um, so yeah, I ended up

[01:12:51] Tyler: in

[01:12:52] Justin: my foot into the prop and it got me on my index toe So it cut [01:13:00] the my big toe my index toe and my middle toe And it felt like I thought I'd lost the toes And here's where it gets like gnarly.

[01:13:15] Justin: I'm like screaming, I'm fucked. And there's blood everywhere. And we're, you know, we're super far out. And by the grace of God, a wave comes. Right? And I was, I, I'm going in. I'm going in. And I catch the wave. And I'm just riding on my belly, flying. It's a solid day. And I just. And I feel my toe flapping, fla like, and I'm like, oh my god, whatever's there, I'm g I'm gonna lose it because there's so much water, maybe I should just fucking bite it off and keep it in my mouth.

[01:13:49] Tyler: ah, ah,

[01:13:50] Justin: And I'm like going back and forth like, cause the wave's going forever and I can feel it like, kinda like just flap, like dangling. And uh, [01:14:00] I go straight, like there's a channel. I fucked the channel. I'm going, I

[01:14:05] Tyler: went over the

[01:14:06] Justin: right over the reef. And as soon as I get on the reef, there's like some big west side boys fit for been fishing and drinking all night And i'm like up on the reef with my one foot like like a crab And i'm not gonna put my foot on this reef.

[01:14:20] Justin: I know exactly how like how dirty this is And uh, you want like a whole brah? That's not good I

[01:14:31] Tyler: ice

[01:14:31] Justin: was like yo pick pick pick me up Get, get me off this reef. I don't, I don't want to see it. No. And he's like, it's, it looks like a massacre. And, uh, and I remember they put me in the back of a pickup, one of the, one of the boys pickups.

[01:14:49] Justin: Campbell comes and they're like, holding my foot up, like keep it elevated to try to stop the bleeding. And one of them's like, bro, do a tourniquet. And I'm like, no fucking tourniquet. , [01:15:00] dude. No. Like, let call an ambulance. Yeah. And uh, like. Campbell, I guess, will hold my foot up and he's like going in and out of consciousness.

[01:15:08] Justin: Uh, and it was just a, like, what a disaster. They told Campbell and Jay that I was going to Queens. And instead they took me to like a clinic, like Wai'anae clinic. And it was like a scene out of like Pulp Fiction. And I was like, they, they're like, do you want us to just cut the three toes off? And I was like, well, can we, can we save him?

[01:15:33] Justin: And he was like, dude, not, not here. He's like, you need to be at Queens. And I was like, I thought that's where they're taking me. He's like, no, they're taking you here. Like the lights are flashing. And I'm like, dude, this is like, this is dirtier than the reef. Like, don't. And he was like, look, I can, I can clean you up.

[01:15:52] Justin: And this is like pre cell phone. So I had to wait for Jay and Campbell to get to Queens hospital.

[01:15:58] Tyler: oh God.

[01:15:58] Justin: Then for them to get the call [01:16:00] to pick me up in the west side, come back to west side. And then by the time I got to Queens, they had like ready for triage because they knew I was an amputee. And it was like, all right, so how bad is it?

[01:16:13] Justin: And he's like, Oh, that's like my toe had turned gray at that

[01:16:18] Tyler: Oh god. Um,

[01:16:19] Justin: and I guess what happened was the two who got the The index toe got severed and it was just hanging by the artery.

[01:16:28] Tyler: god,

[01:16:28] Justin: the bone, the bone was completely cut off.

[01:16:31] Tyler: goodness the artery

[01:16:32] Justin: Yeah, so the, and he's like, hey, we're going to try to move it. And he's like, if I move it this way, it's going to line the toe back up.

[01:16:42] Justin: We'll see if it, if it gets changes color, we know that we might have a chance of saving it. If it doesn't, we're just going to have to take the toes off. And he's like, so morphine, like out the butt. He's like, tell me when you're ready. And I was like, [01:17:00] and he's like, great, you're ready. And he, and I remember before I blacked out, he goes and he moves it.

[01:17:06] Justin: And just blood starts spraying everywhere. And he's like, you're good. And, and I was like, dude, I, and that was it. Like, I completely blacked out. I woke up, um, and it was like, everything was done. He's like, I think that was a success. And he's like, where are your friends? And I was like, I think I sent them surfing.

[01:17:25] Justin: He's like, you're a good friend. I was like, I think it's really good. He's like, it's really good. And he's like, he's like, so like. What do you want to do? I was like, I don't know. I guess I'll just wait for him. He's like, all right, we'll give you another shot of morphine. Blacked me out and woke up Jay and Campbell were like, dude, you ready to go home?

[01:17:41] Justin: I was like, I'm ready to go home, yeah.

[01:17:44] Tyler: I have a lovely Polaroid of that toe. Yeah, totally.

[01:17:47] Justin: That's, that's worth. Yeah. I lost my toe and all you got was this lousy Polaroid. You know what I did? Uh, I got some free lunches from Cholos. I got, uh, definitely [01:18:00] some sympathy from some of the girls. Like, uh,

[01:18:02] Tyler: Kara Hamperly

[01:18:03] Justin: totally, oh my goodness.

[01:18:05] Tyler: back rub

[01:18:06] Justin: So, totally.

[01:18:07] Justin: Gosh, those were the days.

[01:18:09] Tyler: I'm, I'm curious, like then what's a surfer to do when they're in the Mecca of surfing? And they can't surf, and like, what was your mindset after that? And I remember, like, you were saying, like, before we left, like, that was probably one of the best things that ever happened to you, actually, and I'm curious, like, what happens when you remove surfing the place you went to for surfing, and what happens to your mindset?

[01:18:38] Justin: So, when, So the way that the surgery went was he cut through some muscles and some, um, Thankfully some nerves so the healing process because I had so much nerve damage. It wasn't all that painful [01:19:00] Like ain't ain't like So this is the tip of your toe and for a while you could be like this and there'd be no No, it's a no feeling whatsoever.

[01:19:13] Justin: Like you could take a pin to it And I couldn't feel it. Take a pencil. And the doctor's like, this is what you're gonna have to be really careful about. Because you're gonna think you can walk on it. And you can't feel that you just ripped everything open. And he's like, don't, don't be a dummy and do anything too soon.

[01:19:30] Justin: It's, you know, it's, um, it's a traumatic injury. So, uh,

[01:19:37] Justin: I started to, you know, just getting like stir crazy, just can't do anything. Don't want to go to the beach and get sand in it and this and that. And finally he's like, you know, if you want to like wrap it in a plastic bag and like you could kind of paddle around on a board.

[01:19:54] Justin: And he's like, you can't get it in the water because you're going to get it infected. It is too many things that can go [01:20:00] wrong. It's like, but if you want to keep it out of the water and just start to paddle. I was like, Oh my God, I can paddle. I can And my buddy from Australia who was there when I got into the accident had a, uh, Uh, prone paddle board that was shaped by Joe Quigg

[01:20:18] Justin: It's an old, old board under his, uh, A frame at Rocky Point. And he's like, man, I got this beat ass fuckin paddle board. He's like, what do you have at it? And I was like, oh my god, that That's awesome. And I had that house right, you know, right behind Waimea, on the Haleiwa side of Waimea Bay. So you go from the back of the house right to, um,

[01:20:43] Justin: whatever the hell that

[01:20:46] Justin: right there? That's not, it's, it's, it's, um, north of alligators. It's like a random, it's seldom surfed, um, because it really rarely, it has to be huge for it to be even anything there. So it's [01:21:00] a great spot to embark on a paddleboard journey. Uh, because it's always pretty flat. It wasn't rocky, like, reefy.

[01:21:10] Justin: So you could go in and out. And I start, you know, little by little. It's like, alright, let me, I paddle across the bay. Because it was summertime. It's the bay's flattest could be. Oh man, that was so, that was so cool. I paddled across the bay. Let me try to go farther out. Because you know how deep it gets so fast.

[01:21:25] Justin: Now you're in a couple thousand feet of water. And you're like a mile out past the bay and you're like, wow, this is, this is awesome. And you're starting to like, then your mind starts to be like, Oh, that's pretty, I know how fishy it is too. And I'm like, Oh, I should probably be closer to the beach or doing this with someone else.

[01:21:43] Justin: Um, but I, I just started really enjoy being on the water, uh, and, and the, the act of just paddling. And, you know, go back to history and the, the famous quote from Jerry [01:22:00]Lopez, surfing is 99 percent paddling. And 1 percent is actually being on your feet and surfing. So, you know, oh, you're in the water and there's always this one dude who just catches everything.

[01:22:13] Justin: I guarantee that guy was either a swimmer,

[01:22:16] Tyler: or

[01:22:17] Justin: or a paddler, or

[01:22:18] Justin: did water polo or something. And he may not be the best surfer, or she. But I guarantee this person swam their ass off and knows the technique. So, um My buddy, so I was at Waimea, my buddy lived at Rocky Point, and one day I was like, Yo, I'm meet you at your house for coffee and bong hits this morning.

[01:22:44] Justin: I, I'm gonna paddle. And he's like, What? And I was like, Yeah, I'm just gonna paddle it. And I was like, cause your house is like just right off the beach, I'll leave the prone board right up on the, in the bush, I'll walk up to your house, we'll have coffee, and I'm gonna paddle home. [01:23:00] And he's like, You are? And I was like, Yeah, I'll be there in like 45 minutes.

[01:23:04] Justin: This is like a three and a half mile paddle. Boom, I'm at his house, I'm having coffee. And I was like, this is awesome. I could, I could paddle to Haleiwa. I could paddle to work. I could, yeah, I could totally paddle to work, throw the board behind Haleiwa Joes, and then paddle my way home. And so I just started to do more and more of like, well, alright, I'd paddle to sunset.

[01:23:29] Justin: You know, I really want to Paddle past Covella and get up to Turtle Bay. And so,

[01:23:37] Tyler: like,

[01:23:38] Justin: now you're just like, oh man, yeah, now I'm hitting it out. And people are like.

[01:23:42] Justin: Were you at Turtle Bay yesterday? And I was like, no, no. It's like, you know, I never go in there. They're like, no, no. Were you at Turtle Bay? And I was like, oh yeah, yeah.

[01:23:50] Justin: I was like, man, did you see me paddle? And I was like, I paddle all the time. They're like, do you like, I was like every day. I was like, I love it. And so, yeah, that was, that was it. I just, and [01:24:00] I always, um, I just got more and more into it. Um,

[01:24:08] Justin: Because

[01:24:09] Justin: in summertime, it's what you do to be in the water. It's either your spearfishing or your paddleboarding.

[01:24:17] Justin: And it is, you know, that kind of predates the standup. Yeah. So that wasn't

[01:24:23] Tyler: 2001.

[01:24:24] Justin: that wasn't on anyone's radar besides the Beach Boys and Waikiki who were doing it to kind of like put a camera on their board and take pictures of the people who they're, uh But yeah, so yeah, the prone was amazing and then it also was awesome because when I got the okay to start to surf again.

[01:24:44] Justin: I was ready in that. Yeah, it's like, man, I'm paddle ready. Yeah, and I was like, and I don't, I don't feel like the surfing aspect, which was just 1 percent of it anyway. So yeah, that, um, you know, and that started a lifelong [01:25:00] love of, you know, pro and paddle boarding. And I'm, I'm more of the old school.

[01:25:08] Justin: Um, I had one arm and then the next.

[01:25:12] Justin: I'm not I, I can't, I, I, I'm so terrible at it, and I see guys who are so good at the knee, like the deep knee stroke, and I'm like, but that, that's, that's not how I paddle. Yeah. Yeah, so if I'm in the water all the time, and I'm surfing all the time, I want to keep doing it like how I have been doing it, so it feels awkward to make that shift to the knee.

[01:25:39] Tyler: to the knee.

[01:25:42] Tyler: You're apparently, you're, this is pre water, waterproof headphones and iPads and I, you know, all that shit. Like you, it's just you and your brain. And like the only way to keep yourself focused is to focus on each stroke and perfecting that technique and getting it [01:26:00] better. Right? Like,

[01:26:01] Justin: and I'm picking up on like the little nuances of the ocean currents. Um, and like connecting windswale versus groundswale, downwinders versus upwinders, you know, and um. And just enjoy being in nature, flying fish going over you, a pod of dolphins, a fin, you have no fucking clue what it was. And you're just like, that was a fin?

[01:26:26] Justin: Huh, okay. So, it's just, I think,

[01:26:31] Justin: anyone, you

[01:26:33] Justin: know, everyone wants to be a water man, or a water woman. And, especially, it doesn't matter where you are. There's never surf all the time. And it's that opportunity for you to step back and say, Okay, what else am I going to do to continue my pursuit of being in the water all the time?

[01:26:54] Justin: So, I think, I, I had perforated my eardrum when I was [01:27:00] living in Hawaii, which I think I had told that story already. So, I, I think that kind of put me out of the

[01:27:06] Justin: spearfishing, like I wanted to. Because it always messed with my ear when I'd go real deep. Um, and to, to get my equilibrium, it seemed really tough.

[01:27:18] Justin: And I was like, man, I want to get these guys. You know, I was fishing with Perry and he was going down like 110 feet free diving. And he was like the Hawaii guy. Free, you know, free dive champion, like six years running. And, you know, had all these crazy stories of, you know, uh, spearfishing with his son and everything like that.

[01:27:35] Justin: And I 30 feet and I feel like my head's going to explode. So it wasn't, you know, I, I think that said. Breath training you got and again, just the time in the water from that and learning the currents that go underwater and what's underwater, um, is is huge, you know, and people, I think people forget [01:28:00] that and they don't.

[01:28:02] Justin: Take the time to study that, like, it's not just how the wave's breaking it, like, take a look at what's underneath the wave, take a look at how this currents are going. You know, I, I kind of like to sit there and like hang out on the beach for a little bit and everyone's like, ah, you f Quit jerking off and get in the water.

[01:28:21] Justin: And I like, I kind of just want to watch it for a minute. So that once I'm out there, I'm not going like, where, where should I be? Oh, I, I should be here. I should be there. And you're kind of like a chicken without a head. Take the five minutes, get yourself a couple of deep breaths. Watch it, you know, and then on the flat days, go paddle it, go dive it and see what's underneath.

[01:28:42] Justin: And oh. That's why the wave always wants to break over here. Oh, and this, I get it, and this swell, there's like, there's a really deep hole right here. So it always, it always flattens out at this angle. I never realized that. So, and, uh, like in Hawaii, in the summer, everyone would dive the [01:29:00] reefs that weren't completely covered with sand.

[01:29:02] Justin: And even, like just, even seeing pipeline in the summer when it's half way covered, you're like, fuck, it's treacherous. It's like, dude, it's, it's flat, and I'm scared of these caves right now, and I get it, and no wonder people get so fucked up

[01:29:18] Tyler: so fucked up. You can see

[01:29:21] Justin: You can see teeth on the reef, you can see teeth, you know, and it's just like, oh my god, you, that's, Well, that's why, shout out to Eric Iken,

[01:29:34] Tyler: Iken,

[01:29:35] Justin: you know, dad,

[01:29:37] Tyler: Don, who left his, left his teeth there at

[01:29:39] Justin: that's why they call it gums. Exactly. It's

[01:29:44] Tyler: funny, like I, um, when, when I was there with, like at the same time as you, my thing was I'd always just go diving at Shark's Cove. I would do the, the cave dives and just hold my breath. And like, I was, I was lucky enough where I could, you know, and. It was like, [01:30:00]probably I enjoyed that more than most of the surfing I did that summer.

[01:30:04] Tyler: You know, like that was like the best thing, like diving through the caves, just holding your breath, learning to stay calm, learning like all the things you, you should be learning to do when you go surf, you know? And like, we don't really have that here where we grew up, like hard to, to go. Cave diving off a long beach or

[01:30:24] Justin: No, I, I, I mean there is some good spearfishing for sure. Um, and some good, uh, free, you know, free dive sites. Yeah. Um, there's a good group of surfers, you know, ball and Sam and I mean a ton of guys who all are huge into it and are crushing it.

[01:30:45] Justin: And again, it's. That is opening up a hole. You know, there's so much time when it's flat. Those guys spearfished the whole fuckin summer cause it was flat and crystal clear waters all summer.

[01:30:56] Tyler: And they're in great shape for doing You [01:31:00] know? So, you're paddling. How much longer did you hang on the North Shore then, like, after the accident?

[01:31:08] Justin: the next accident.

[01:31:10] Justin: accident,

[01:31:10] Tyler: which was a car

[01:31:11] Justin: Yeah, that was the car accident. So that was uh, Halloween, uh,

[01:31:18] Justin: yeah.

[01:31:19] Justin: Funny, cause my health insurance kicked in for work at midnight, and the accident was like 12 18. was crazy. Yeah, but it was, it was a really bad accident. And, um,

[01:31:36] Tyler: Do you remember what happened?

[01:31:37] Justin: yeah, yeah, you know, we're, uh, coming back from partying, uh, in maybe Guamanolo or something. And, uh, yeah. It had been raining, I had a 69 Dart, and hit the [01:32:00]curve in Cam Highway, coming past Laniakea. And, as soon as I went to step on the brake, the left, the driver's side wheel locked up. Just one wheel. And I was like, fuck, dude, we're sliding. And we're spun out. And the side of the road, both the medians are sand.

[01:32:20] Justin: You know, there's no, so the second I hit the sand, we're just flipped. And we did, um, what's called a California Roll. You know, there's a name for every car accident. When a car does a certain thing, there's nothing new under the sun as far as what the car does. So the California Roll, it goes side over side and end over end.

[01:32:46] Tyler: Oh my god! Holy shitballs. I

[01:32:50] Justin: surfers still can't do that, by the Um, so yeah, it was really bad. The car was totaled. Um, both me and my friend [01:33:00] were airlifted to Queens Hospital. Um, he was pinned under the car, which was awful. Um, I was pinned in the car. And the, uh, gearshift, I was impelled on the

[01:33:17] Tyler: on the deer shift. I was

[01:33:21] Justin: uh, went right,

[01:33:22] Tyler: held. So like, I was steering

[01:33:26] Justin: like, I ate, I ate the steering wheel. And I kinda went into the windshield. And rolled. As it rolled, it kind of like, so now I'm, I'm like on the steering wheel and I can hear my buddy. And I was ah, and I kicked out the windshield, got myself out. And within, I want to say it's, it seemed like minutes. I can't, I can't tell you. I, [01:34:00] the first people there were Joel Tudor and Dino Miranda. And I was like, no And they're this is so bad, you're so And I was like, I didn't,

[01:34:16] Tyler: Like, thanks Joel.

[01:34:17] Justin: couldn't even assess how fucked up I was and I just wanted my, make sure my friend was okay.

[01:34:21] Tyler: ok.

[01:34:22] Justin: And, you know, just like get, you know, get help, get help. You gotta get, you know. So,

[01:34:30] Justin: uh, the fire department arrives. They got my buddy out from under the car right away, and he, and they're like, he's okay. And I was like. As soon as they said that, I collapsed. I just went unconscious, and they, um, they were worried I broke my neck.

[01:34:52] Justin: And that the adrenaline was just keeping me going. And at once, my friend was okay, [01:35:00] that I just gave in.

[01:35:03] Justin: So, I think I

[01:35:04] Justin: woke up once on the side of the helicopter. There's a word on the

[01:35:09] Tyler: the

[01:35:10] Justin: No, I

[01:35:11] Justin: missed it. Um, and then I woke up. Again, it was in Queens Hospital. So it was my second time in Queens Hospital in like fucking five months.

[01:35:21] Tyler: Became a regular.

[01:35:22] Justin: Oh, they all knew me. And they're like, no way are you back? What did you do this

[01:35:27] Tyler: Howley, it's a little dangerous for you here.

[01:35:29] Justin: Serious, like, take a, take a sign. So I, they had me in a full, um, a full body brace. So that's how I woke up. And then the doctor

[01:35:42] Tyler: What goes through your head when you wake up in a full body brace?

[01:35:47] Justin: I gotta pee.

[01:35:49] Tyler: No catheter? They didn't, uh Shit.

[01:35:53] Justin: don't think they were, they just figured I would piss Um, [01:36:00] and the doctor, you know, the trauma doctor who reattached my toe was at the hospital and he's like, what the hell? And I was like, I, you gotta take the body brace he's like, well, you gotta run more x rays, CAT scans, and MRIs.

[01:36:20] Justin: I was like, I would tell you. If something is broken in my neck or my back, I would know. And I said, I'll tell you what's broken right now is all my ribs.

[01:36:35] Justin: And I said, something's really fucked up in my bicep. But I'm like, I'm still in a, like, I'm

[01:36:43] Justin: Splayed out

[01:36:44] Justin: like Christ. You know, and that's how, and so my arms are out and everything's just plastic, top and bottom.

[01:36:51] Justin: All the way to around my crotch. And he's like, well, I, let me get the other doctors in here [01:37:00] I'll tell them I will get another, and I was like, you already did it. You, you know what I'm telling you.

[01:37:08] Tyler: don't Don't

[01:37:09] Justin: Don't continue to run these stupid tests right now.

[01:37:11] Tyler: Don't waste my insurance

[01:37:13] Justin: gotta, I gotta

[01:37:14] Tyler: My co pay is not going to. Yeah.

[01:37:20] Justin: what do I, and he's like, you can't pee.

[01:37:22] Justin: I said, then I'm just gonna pee. And I said, and it's a lot. And he's like, uh, and he like kind of like helped me up and so like I'm now like walking and he's like, he's like, are you going to be okay? I like trying to get into the bathroom with him and it's like a freaking comedy. I like I'm standing there and I was like I can't.

[01:37:46] Justin: And he's like, what do you mean? I was like, I

[01:37:49] Justin: No, I, I, cause I had the

[01:37:50] Tyler: this shit

[01:37:51] Justin: on. No, I had the thing on and my arms are out. I can't move. I can't pull the thing up. I'm just going to pee all over the gown. [01:38:00] And he was like, well, I was like, I need more help. And he's like, I'm not, I was like, just take the gown off then.

[01:38:06] Justin: I was like, I don't know. It was

[01:38:08] Tyler: like, do you want me to hold it for you as well? You want me to shake it?

[01:38:10] Justin: it? And it was like a, I Uh, out of that dumb and dumber, it was like a 10 minute pee. And he's like, really? And I was like, oh,

[01:38:17] Tyler: was Austin Powers style.

[01:38:19] Justin: so, yeah, the worst. And, uh, you know,

[01:38:24] Justin: I was so thankful that both

[01:38:29] Justin: me and my friend walked away.

[01:38:31] Tyler: a little bit quicker

[01:38:34] Justin: his lung. Okay. Yeah. And broke ribs too. So we both

[01:38:38] Tyler: think I don't know if

[01:38:41] Justin: I think even

[01:38:45] Justin: His recovery time was a little bit quicker than mine. Um, I don't know, just because I, I think, I don't even, I just broke so many things. And then, so it [01:39:00] took, and then I came home, I was just going to come home for a little bit. And it was, I, on the flight home, cause it was already really messed up. On the flight home, I contracted Coxsackievirus.

[01:39:18] Tyler: Explain, cause I'm not familiar with it.

[01:39:21] Justin: virus is a virus that started in Coxsackie, New York. And, go shout out Coxsackie.

[01:39:27] Tyler: Coxsackie.

[01:39:28] Justin: So,

[01:39:30] Justin: Yeah, it's like a, like a Legionnaires or something like that. Yeah, and so it was, someone had it on the plane, and because my immune system was so shot, that I was just, I would've, I would've got anything that was, anyone had had on that plane.

[01:39:46] Justin: Um, and then, so I was already beat up and I was,

[01:39:52] Justin: see, from 180 down to about 1 'cause I, my, [01:40:00] I broke my jaw too, so my jaw wired shot. And then came home, I contracted Kazaki, I got down to one 10.

[01:40:10] Tyler: to

[01:40:10] Justin: So it, and by the time it was all said and done, I was down 70 pounds. I looked like. Like, just nothing. I, no, no muscle, no, no anything.

[01:40:23] Tyler: no no, anything. What, um, what does that do for

[01:40:28] Justin: most demoralizing thing ever. I made my parents life, like, a living hell when I was sick. Stuck in the house. It took, it was, it took people a long time to even Like, diagnose it. So, because people are, I guess it's not a very common virus. Um, it sucked 'cause you couldn't eat and like your tongue bleeds.

[01:40:53] Tyler: these

[01:40:55] Justin: So you like have these like, whatever,

[01:40:58] Tyler: Just like blisters in your mouth [01:41:00] kind of thing. Ugh, paper cuts on your tongue. Ugh! Listeners, just imagine that for a second. Paper cuts on your

[01:41:08] Justin: and just like, so you feel like you're, you're, you feel like you're salivating. And you're not.

[01:41:14] Justin: It's just blood.

[01:41:15] Tyler: ugh.

[01:41:16] Justin: And, uh, we finally go to another doctor, cause we've been to a million already. And we're waiting on the doctor, and the nurse walks in, and she's like, Stick out your tongue. And she's like, Ugh, you have Kokusaki. I was like, I do?

[01:41:30] Tyler: person I've

[01:41:31] Justin: Ugh, what the hell? She's like, My daughter had

[01:41:34] Justin: I was like, What?

[01:41:35] Justin: She's like, No one, She's like, You're the only person I've ever seen who's had that. And I was like, thank you. So it was like, what do I do? She's like, not much.

[01:41:44] Tyler: much.

[01:41:46] Justin: And I was like, Oh God. And I was like, one of those says, um, yeah, it was just, it was really demoralizing, um, you know, cause I went from like the strongest and fittest I'd ever been and feeling.

[01:41:59] Justin: [01:42:00] So mentally focused and like to take on anything and from that to just being like, I'm not sure I'll make it to the bathroom, you know, and I just feel so weak today. I can't, I don't even, you know, and the recovery, it, um,

[01:42:17] Justin: like it took a long time.

[01:42:20] Justin: Um, and it was like, it was definitely with that baby steps to getting better.

[01:42:27] Justin: Um, I had good, so back in New York, I had good friends, a good surf community. Um, and they really, you know, like every day you're, you're back in the water. You're back, you know, we're going to surf, we're surf, we're Um, and that was awesome. And it, it just took a long time. Um,

[01:42:49] Justin: and then fast forward and I don't remember what year it was, but the first Sea paddle.

[01:42:55] Justin: Yeah.

[01:42:55] Tyler: to raise money for Surf for

[01:42:58] Justin: So, um, [01:43:00] that was raised money for surfers healing and autism awareness. I, I was already doing a lot, a good amount of work with Surfers Healing, got invited to participate in the first paddle. Um, Mike Becker made me a wicked prone board Nice. For that race. Uh, so shout out to Nature Shapes.

[01:43:19] Justin: That was the first prone, maybe the only one he's ever made. It was awesome. Wow. And, uh. So go to the race, lo and behold, Joel Tudor is there doing the race, the paddle too. And I see him, and his jaw and he's like white as a ghost. And he's like, I thought you And he's

[01:43:39] Tyler: about that. Seeing you, uh, dead. He's

[01:43:43] Justin: like, we always talk about that, like, like, seeing you on, like, dude. You are dead meat. Dead, like roadkill. Roadkill. He's like, I can't believe, I was like, I'm here. I'm gonna fucking paddle around Manhattan with you right now. And he's like, you know, and afterwards he's [01:44:00]like, I can't, believe it's you.

[01:44:03] Justin: You know, I was like, and it was a big, you know, business you almost take for granted. The recovery, once you're better, and you're kind of like out of sight, out of mind, but then people you hadn't seen in a long time, and who saw you at your lowest moment, are like, holy shit, you were, you were a dead man.

[01:44:23] Tyler: Makes you realize.

[01:44:24] Justin: It does.

[01:44:25] Justin: It does. You know, and you, You need to, I started to like, I'll be 50 this year. Um, so that happened, that car accident happened when I was 20, both accidents happened when I was 25 going into 26. So, this'll be, I'll, I'll be, I'll, I, this will be my 24th bonus year,

[01:44:49] Tyler: every, you

[01:44:50] Justin: yeah. So every, you know, and every so often I'll be like, yeah, just a, these are my, like, every year's a bonus year.

[01:44:57] Justin: Because I did everything I [01:45:00] could at 26 to pretty much kill myself. And not in like a self destructive way. Just fuck. Yeah, bad luck. And just that's, you know, that's just how it goes. And that's, that's a hard thing also to wrap your head around is how does all this stuff keep happening to me? Um, and how do you, how do you get yourself, you know, out of that, you know, I'm never gonna, it's bad luck or no luck at

[01:45:27] Tyler: luck and no luck at all. Like, like I'm, I'm just gonna say like, I remember I broke my foot really bad in Morocco and like it kind of similar thing like where it just got so fucked where I, when I got home, like the doctor said, I may never walk again, may never surf again, all these things and like, you know, and to go from like being so Vigorous and so like full of yourself and then to not only have this injury, but then to go [01:46:00] home, not just to like an independent home, but a home with your family, your parents are watching over you.

[01:46:05] Tyler: I remember leaving like my mom had to like wash me at one point, which was so demoralizing. Like you just start for me, I was breaking down in tears and it's like such a hard mental thing to deal with. And I'm curious, like yours is even worse. Like.

[01:46:21] Justin: I, uh,

[01:46:26] Justin: Once I knew I was, like, better, like the no more virus. I wanted to get, I wanted to get strong, like I needed to get some muscle back on me. Um. And I was lucky when I got back to New York, um, to hook up with Gene Cooper and Tom Parrish, um, and start a good conversation with both those shapers who are just incredible human beings and the best, you know, some of the best [01:47:00] shapers in the world.

[01:47:01] Justin: Um, and they were stoked to make me boards and that made me stoked. To want to ride their boards and not just ride them but ride them well and that would require me to get better

[01:47:22] Justin: and be as healthy as I was but I don't but not I never got it I Never was able to put back like the

[01:47:34] Justin: This the,

[01:47:34] Justin: bulk and size that I had in Hawaii

[01:47:37] Tyler: Hawaii.

[01:47:38] Justin: I, maybe from having my jaw wired shut for the 10 weeks, or, it just shrunk, it just shrunk myself.

[01:47:45] Justin: And, uh, um, but I, I,

[01:47:50] Justin: I would just like, every morning, wake up, make myself a coffee, and I could, we had a sit up bench, I remember. [01:48:00] And my parents And I was like, alright, they have 5 pound weights, and a sit up bench. Alright, I could 5 pound weights, and just hammer. Hammer. Repetition, repetition, repetition.

[01:48:13] Justin: Sit ups. All right. I can do 30. All right. I can do 50. I can do a hundred. All right. I'm going to get up a half hour earlier cause now I can do 500. Alright, I can do 500. Let's, you know, let's get all Bruce Lee on this shit. Let's do a thousand. Let's be Herschel Walker and say, we're just gonna,

[01:48:34] Justin: a thousand pushups and two thousand sit ups in a day.

[01:48:37] Justin: So now I gotta get up earlier. So I'm gonna, cause I want, I want to. Get myself back where I was, but be, have my body be stronger in different ways so that if I would, if I'm injured again, I'm less prone to being injured. Um, and that's something [01:49:00] Through the last 24 years, I've tried to maintain, and sometimes you do it better than others, but it's, you know, as you get older, um, taking care of yourself to prevent injury, um, and making sure that you're able to maintain balance.

[01:49:22] Justin: Is it's, you know, it's injuries and, and people just forget how hard it is to fucking balance. Cause, you know, I, I'm at, I've been going to the gym for like a month now. Which is pretty, pretty good. But, I see this guy on a medicine ball doing like a crane pose. On a, oh he's balancing on one leg with his other leg out on a fucking medicine ball.

[01:49:51] Justin: The ball's like wobbling around. I can't do that.

[01:49:56] Justin: I, I I can't, I can't do that. And I'm like, man, okay, [01:50:00] so I, I feel stronger, I feel like there's less things that are going to hurt. But at the same time, I see that there's other things that you need to incorporate. Not only as you, I shouldn't incorporated them.

[01:50:16] Justin: 30 years ago, but I just don't think it was on my plane. So it, you know, as I hit that 50 mark, I don't want to,

[01:50:25] Justin: I

[01:50:25] Justin: want, I don't want to lose surfing. You know, there's, um, I want to surf until they find me floating in the water face up. And you're like, well, fuck, he died doing what he loved. And, you know, he wouldn't want to go out any other way.

[01:50:40] Justin: And that requires you to. You know, to maintain yourself and when it's flat for six months, you have to, you have to have other things.

[01:50:50] Tyler: It's so true. It's so true. Um, yeah, I've been kettlebelling for like the last couple years and it's such a, makes such a difference. Like the [01:51:00] balance stuff that we do, like I don't feel like I get as injured as easily. Although I still every once in a while turn the wrong way and feel it, you know,

[01:51:10] Justin: yeah, I was doing, like doing a funny turn all summer long on, on the, on the Like the 10 foot long board.

[01:51:19] Justin: I was like, dropping a hammer. Like, big, like, stand the board up and cut it back so like the whole nose is out of the water and you just jam the tail. I was every time I do it, it hurts my knee. So, you know, you'd be like, stop doing it. And I'd be like, no, I'm just gonna keep doing it and do it harder.

[01:51:39] Justin: At one point I was like,

[01:51:40] Tyler: pushing

[01:51:41] Justin: yeah, I don't think I can walk up a stair anymore. And I was like, alright. Time to take a step back and think about what, what's the underlying, what's going on with that? I can't do that turn anymore. What, what did I tweak or what muscle or tendons am I not, you know, focusing on?

[01:51:59] Justin: I, [01:52:00] I think

[01:52:01] Justin: right now it's all about hips, hip mobility and hip strength for

[01:52:06] Tyler: Pigeon pose all day long, man. It's my savior

[01:52:09] Justin: So, you know, that, that, um, so I, I guess I'm learning. More about my body and try to take in more supplements and all that

[01:52:22] Tyler: AG1 coming at ya. Show sponsor, by the way.

[01:52:26] Justin: Oh,

[01:52:26] Tyler: kidding. Show again,

[01:52:28] Justin: Shilligant and uh, Whatever it is, turkey tail

[01:52:33] Tyler: show. Got some collagen. Got some

[01:52:36] Justin: All that, um But I, so back to, so I, I think, yeah, Gene and Tom and getting awesome boards from awesome people, uh, and being super stoked, like them being super stoked, um, we also, it, like that 2002 to 2010 or 2003,[01:53:00]

[01:53:03] Justin: To probably about Sandy, dude, we had epic runs of epic, you know, that was a decade of, of epic surf. Um, to the point that sometimes I'm like,

[01:53:17] Justin: you know, it's like an amalgamation of swells because it was so good and so consistent for so long. And, you know, like, you know, Todd, uh,

[01:53:28] Tyler: yeah, TDC. He would

[01:53:31] Justin: I think, like, I would surf, he would come up from Jersey, and we would surf behind the house. All the time and it'd be pumping all the time. And like he and I were just messaging back and forth the other day, like how long it's been since we surfed together.

[01:53:46] Justin: How long has it been since it's been like that quality run of like epic, epic

[01:53:51] Tyler: York and this decade.

[01:53:57] Justin: Yeah. And now it west. Yep, [01:54:00] totally. You know, I mean it, it's. So, uh, I would, with that being said, I guess you could say that, that decade shown more on New York, and this more recent one has been Jersey. I fucking hate Jersey.

[01:54:16] Tyler: I don't like going backhand.

[01:54:17] Justin: I have stupid rights. And it's

[01:54:20] Tyler: And it's so expensive to go there!

[01:54:23] Justin: gosh. I

[01:54:24] Tyler: and then they get you on the tolls, and like, can't park, can't get changed in the street, like, I'm over

[01:54:31] Justin: and don't even get me started about deal.

[01:54:33] Tyler: Oh God, no, no. And then Jersey, and Jersey surfers, I love you guys, and I respect you guys, but uh, I'm a goofy foot, and I'm lazy as fuck when it comes to that.

[01:54:42] Justin: That's totally, I I think it's the lazy point. I'm like, am I gonna make that drive just to go?

[01:54:47] Justin: Right.

[01:54:48] Tyler: Nah,

[01:54:49] Justin: Yeah. And then sometimes I'm like, oh wait, dude, I forgot. Yeah. You could have gone here or there. It's just, it's a hike. I, I think Yeah. You know, like,

[01:54:57] Tyler: I'm just about

[01:54:59] Justin: just about to say, I'm [01:55:00] just, I'm kind of just as close for me to get to Rhode Island now. Yeah. Um, so that, that's certainly, um,

[01:55:08] Justin: more, uh, more options.

[01:55:09] Justin: Yeah. Um, but there. Yeah, there's swirls and not to like blow anything up, but like Long Island sucks for Rhode Island. We block so much swell. You know, I talk to the Rhode Island surfers, they would love to just blow up the island. Or at least the east end. So there's a lot of swell that Jersey will get, that Rhode Island, you know, that we'll get.

[01:55:32] Justin: And, you know, south of us, in Rhode Island, they'll never see any of it. Cause it'll, the storm just goes out to sea from us. Um, but that's a, you know.

[01:55:42] Justin: New England holds and it's an, it's an entirely different beast.

[01:55:47] Tyler: I wanna ask like then, so you come home from Hawaii and like. You had to get a job then, too. You ended up working for like, Chase, I think? In some of the banks, and going [01:56:00]like, from full vagabond, to full straight laced wearing a suit.

[01:56:04] Justin: that sucked.

[01:56:05] Tyler: What did that do to your soul?

[01:56:07] Justin: Um, you know, it was. I was, I was doing mortgages for JPMorgan Chase in Brooklyn and I moved, I moved to Long Beach and the way, they kind of were a little, um, like if there's no surf, you should be working.

[01:56:36] Tyler: Yeah.

[01:56:37] Justin: If you're not here, we just assume that you're surfing. Otherwise you're here. And I'm like, uh, yeah, I have, I have no life. So I, that's a, my life revolves around surfing. I am not going to blow off work. Well, I've still, I would, I would blow a fork for a waist high day. So, um, but yeah, [01:57:00] and that was, it'll, it allowed that opportunity.

[01:57:02] Justin: So I still, I still got to surf my balls off. And I remember, um, Being at a big sales meeting, um, with one of my buddies who I got a job for at Chase, who also lived in Long Beach, and we're like in opposite ends of the room, and there's probably like 400 of us in the room, all of a sudden I'm like, Uh, the flag just

[01:57:26] Tyler: here.

[01:57:26] Tyler: I'm like, like,

[01:57:28] Justin: And I'm like, oh man. Alright, don't freak out. And I'm like texting my buddy. And he's like looking around the room for me. And I'm like, yo, I'm fucking outta here. And he was like, no one's going to see us leave, and he's like, well, will they see both of us leave? I said, not from opposite ends of the room. So of course we're dumbasses.

[01:57:48] Justin: We both get up at the same time.

[01:57:51] Justin: Everyone turns And

[01:57:52] Tyler: Jamie Dimon turns to you and is

[01:57:55] Justin: we just both walk out and we're like, walk faster, walk faster, walk faster. And it was good. It [01:58:00] was like, you know, that was one of those times where I could say it wasn't like a mistake. going off its face, and, you know, it's, Surfline still fucks it up all the time, so there's one of those ones, it, it, it switched midday, Surfline had already put the report out, they weren't gonna change anything, so everyone's like, oh it sucks, so it was, you know, a bender of an afternoon, evening, of, Pumping surf with just, you know, just the local crew, so, we all saw the flag switch at the same time.

[01:58:32] Tyler: same time.

[01:58:33] Tyler: Jump what

[01:58:34] Justin: what you're doing.

[01:58:35] Tyler: then it's like, and then you came back into the work the next day and they're like,

[01:58:38] Justin: They're like, what happened? I was like, oh, um,

[01:58:42] Justin: Uh, yeah, and they're like, John's or yours? And I was like, yes,

[01:58:48] Tyler: that's

[01:58:51] Justin: and, so it was, um. How long did that

[01:58:54] Tyler: How long did that last, that career? It was a while, [01:59:00] right?

[01:59:00] Justin: probably six, seven years.

[01:59:02] Justin: Um, I think till the, the housing, the housing collapse, which was like 2008, yeah, 2008, 2009. And I just went back to doing what I had always done, working in restaurants. Um, started working in restaurants when I was 12 in Malvern. Um, and, um, yeah. In Hawaii at, you know, in college. I did it all through college.

[01:59:27] Justin: I did it in Hawaii. Um, I worked at Hollywood Jews, which was amazing. Um, I don't even remember if I talked about this before, but it was, I just was a dishwasher and did you as a waiter or bartender, you made so much money as a dishwasher. You got a little bit of tips at the end of the night, both from the Bar and from the waitstaff you got fed two meals one at the start of the shift one to close out at the end

[01:59:59] Tyler: the [02:00:00] end. Whenever

[02:00:00] Justin: Whatever you wanted as far as that and and again

[02:00:06] Justin: if the surf was pumping I Just oh, I'm not kind of go to work.

[02:00:13] Justin: I'm the fucking dishwasher, I'm you're not gonna fire me

[02:00:18] Justin: No one wants to wash

[02:00:20] Tyler: those

[02:00:21] Justin: So it's just one of those. And so I, I was really lucky in that on those epic days where I was on the schedule, I would, I would blow it off and I would hear it, but like, I remember I didn't show up on a Christmas.

[02:00:42] Justin: So

[02:00:42] Justin: I was the only dishwasher on for the day for all of Christmas, and we surfed Makaha and it was, it was the best I'd ever seen it. And it was, uh,

[02:00:57] Justin: Dave Troll was out and um, [02:01:00] oh God. Um, I'll remember, uh,

[02:01:05] Justin: Downing. Um, Keoni Downing. Keoni Downing was out to with Cantrell and they're coming in and I'm How big like, it's 15 to 18 oh yeah. They're not, you know, and they're

[02:01:22] Tyler: phone, I

[02:01:23] Justin: it was so massive. And, um, we got out of the water, go to the, uh, the gas station, get a payphone, I got a call. And it's like, I'm already four hours late to work, and I'm on the west side.

[02:01:43] Justin: By the time we got back, I would have missed, you know, I'd be like there for the, I was like, I'm not coming in. I'm like, you quit? And I was like, no, no, no. I don't quit. I don't quit. I was like, I'm just not working today. They're like, you're quitting. And I was like, no, who quits on Christmas Day? [02:02:00] I'll be in tomorrow.

[02:02:01] Justin: They're like, you're fucking, you're gonna kill you tomorrow. Okay, okay, I'll see you guys tomorrow.

[02:02:05] Tyler: tomorrow. Kill me tomorrow, it's worth it.

[02:02:07] Justin: They're like, And I was like, oh, it's, it's fucking epic. And they're like, we'll see you tomorrow, click.

[02:02:15] Justin: And Campbell goes, how did that go? I was like, I was, uh, I think I still got the job. And I go in the next day, um, and I think, so, back it up.

[02:02:29] Justin: Cantrell was a waiter at Holly of the Jews.

[02:02:32] Tyler: Probably even Jewish. So,

[02:02:34] Justin: so, you know, by the next day, Joe, Joe had already talked to Kentrell and confirmed it was in fact epic. I, you know, I come, I'm gonna go in the office and sit down. He's like, don't fucking do that. And I was like, And I said, I can't.

[02:02:53] Tyler: Please

[02:02:54] Justin: I would never make you a promise I can't I can't, I can't do that. [02:03:00] He said, then you'll always be the dishwasher here. You'll never be a waiter. You'll never be a bartender. I like that, Tim. I never said I wanted to be a waiter. I never said I wanted to be a bartender. Johnny and I are always gonna be in the dish pit. If Himalayas is pumping, and Johnny and I happen not to be here, I bet you know where we're gonna be.

[02:03:20] Justin: And he's like, ah, ah.

[02:03:22] Tyler: to

[02:03:23] Tyler: be.

[02:03:24] Justin: it was funny, I did get to surf a, probably, not too long after that conversation with Joe, there was a really good Himalayas swell. And I got to surf it with Joe.

[02:03:39] Justin: And that was awesome because then he was like, Oh, you're not, you know, I get it. You're not full of shit. You actually do kind of like being out here.

[02:03:46] Justin: I joke, um, you know, in addition to being an incredible businessman, phenomenal, phenomenal surfer, he had, um,

[02:03:55] Justin: a spread in, at least it was in longboard magazine, but it [02:04:00] might've been in a surfer's journal too, from like a 12 foot day at Taverula. Huge, huge, and I remember like at first looking at his board and thinking like he was on like a 7 something.

[02:04:16] Justin: And I was so surprised because he always rode like really big logs. I was like, what were you riding? He was like 10. And I was like, ten eight? I thought that was like a seven. He's like, that's how big I like, I remember like every time I'd look at him, like, I don't think I, I don't think I would have gone.

[02:04:35] Justin: I don't know. He's like, you, he's like, yeah, it's hard. It's so perfect, it's hard not to. And I was like, if you wipe out, he's like, you just don't. On a day like that, he's like, you're just so focused, you know? So, yeah.

[02:04:50] Tyler: you, so you went back to working dishes. You also had. Not to, not to harbor on your bad luck here, but your house burned [02:05:00] down, too, not too long after

[02:05:01] Justin: not too long after that,

[02:05:04] Tyler: Your

[02:05:05] Tyler: family house, right? Like, like not too long after

[02:05:08] Justin: that. Yeah, like you

[02:05:10] Tyler: like you just can, you had this shitty couple years of

[02:05:13] Justin: years of luck.

[02:05:15] Tyler: you lost like all your surf memorabilia.

[02:05:22] Justin: A lot of my boards were outside, um, but a lot of the boards got messed up from the, uh, no, it was from the fire department ripping the house apart to try to put the fire out. And then lost, you know, everything inside was just destroyed. Um,

[02:05:39] Tyler: it was

[02:05:40] Justin: yeah, it was, it was, the house was a 1902 Sears Roebuck's house.

[02:05:47] Tyler: Sears Roblox

[02:05:50] Justin: yeah, so, um, It has balloon frame construction, which means the, um, the, [02:06:00] the framing goes from the basement straight up to the roof.

[02:06:05] Justin: And there's no, there's no kicks. There's no break in the floors. It's just, cause back then you could get a 40 foot 2x4 if you wanted. So, the fire start, it was an electric fire that started in the basement. And once it got into the frame of the house, it just goes right up to the roof. So it just blew right from the basement, right up to the roof.

[02:06:29] Justin: And then from the roof, it just burns itself back down. Um, and I was in New Jersey seeing my girlfriend at the time. And I remember, like, we were driving. I don't even remember what. But I get a call from my dad, and he's like, Don't freak out. But the house burned down. And I was like, I remember telling my girlfriend, you turn, turn the car around.

[02:06:54] Tyler: around.

[02:06:54] Tyler: And I

[02:06:55] Justin: And she's like, what? And I was like, turn the fucking car And she's like, [02:07:00] I don't know, we're going. And I was like. I think I reached over and stepped on her brake

[02:07:05] Tyler: pedal.

[02:07:06] Justin: I was like, get the fuck out of the car. I'm driving. And I got back to her house, got in my car, and drove from Jersey to Malvern.

[02:07:15] Justin: I think I made it in like 35 minutes. I was, I was on the shoulder of the belt parkway the whole way. And like, I was waiting for a cop to go, where's the fire? Like pull me over and go, where's the fire? My house,

[02:07:27] Justin: my house

[02:07:27] Tyler: I didn't get

[02:07:29] Justin: I didn't get stopped in and I, and we got there and,

[02:07:33] Tyler: got there. The house

[02:07:36] Justin: the house was pretty, pretty bad.

[02:07:39] Justin: Um, and we lost, you know, it's really, it's, you know, and it's, I feel for all these people in California right now, because when you have a hurricane. So when you have some natural disasters, um, you can salvage, so there's [02:08:00] things that are salvageable. When you have a fire, there's so little that can be saved, and then the stuff that you do save, you never get the smell of the fire out of it, and therefore you're like, it's always a reminder of everything you lost, and it makes it harder to want to hang on to it.

[02:08:17] Justin: Um, so I, I, you know, I feel so, so bad for everyone, uh, that's gone through it, um, because I, I, you know, to say I can relate is like, is an understatement. I, I, I, uh, I, I can, I've been in your shoes and I know, I know how awful it is, um, how lost, um, and, you know, we, we got, my, my parents got absolutely fucked by the insurance company.

[02:08:47] Justin: Go screw Allstate. Where

[02:08:50] Tyler: Where is Luigi Mangione then?

[02:08:54] Justin: I think he was like just a sperm in his dad.

[02:08:57] Tyler: no! Um, so,

[02:08:59] Justin: [02:09:00] it just, you know, uh, insurance companies, you're always in it for the bottom dollar. And so it just, it makes tragedy that much more worse. Um. Because you're just trying to get some, to get back on your feet and to get, uh, to find out what your next steps are and the insurance company is not wanting to give you any roadmap and, and that's just with one family, um, and not, not, not a, not a block, yeah, not a, not a, not a city block, not a town, and now you're talking in California. Right. And so who, and, and at the same time, I, you know, the insurance companies are fucking atrocious. You have to put yourself in their shoes, and they're trying to answer as many questions [02:10:00] as they can for these people, uh, who, been put in this predicament. And it's like the insurance company couldn't answer us because they didn't have, they didn't really, they're not so familiar with this situation.

[02:10:12] Justin: And now you have 17 square miles of the most densely populated area in the country that all wants the same fucking answer we did. And they want the answer yesterday. They want to know where their next move is, how they're going to put their kids into school, where, you know, and it's, it's a lot. Um, and finding.

[02:10:34] Justin: Residences for all these people is going to be a nightmare.

[02:10:37] Tyler: be a nightmare. We,

[02:10:40] Justin: We, you know, we went from

[02:10:44] Justin: Malvern like the first, we were in a residence in, in Plainview for like two months.

[02:10:51] Justin: It

[02:10:51] Tyler: place. It's

[02:10:53] Justin: It's not good. And, and when you're in the residence and it's not a bad place, [02:11:00] it's like, but everyone. Who's staying in a residence in, is families that are in similar situations.

[02:11:09] Justin: Uh, who lost their home and have, are, are forced to, you know, this is their first step to finding what their next steps will be. So, you know, everyone in there is a fucking zombie. No one knows what to do and so it's, it's, it's a weird, it's a weird situation. And there's not enough residence in, in California for all these people.

[02:11:34] Justin: And the short term rental market is a really tricky thing. I, uh, in a normal. You know, so we, like, to find, it took us probably eight months to get back to rebuild, maybe even a little longer.

[02:11:51] Justin: You know, it was like two months at this house, and then they're like, oh, we, you know, we're going to sell the house.

[02:11:56] Justin: You guys got to, here we go again. We're going to try to find another [02:12:00]place. And that's, and that's going to be the same thing for everyone in California, unfortunately.

[02:12:04] Tyler: thing for everyone in California, unfortunately. Yeah, and that ends

[02:12:13] Justin: Yeah, um,

[02:12:15] Justin: so I

[02:12:16] Tyler: I can talk through my

[02:12:20] Justin: yeah, and that, and, and hurricanes especially, um. So, I mean, I can talk of my experience of the one fire, um, but in, in

[02:12:33] Justin: 96,

[02:12:33] Justin: in, uh, when I was at UNCW, uh, we lost our house during Hurricane Fran, um, because we were oceanfront next to Johnny Mercer's pier, and the pier broke off, washed out our house. So the pilings where the house was is crazy.

[02:12:49] Justin: So then when the quicks right before the quick silver pro

[02:12:54] Tyler: 2011,

[02:12:55] Justin: 2011, we got hit with Irene and Irene [02:13:00] messed up some of the houses on the bay side. Um, and so we got to, we got to like

[02:13:06] Justin: A good taste. Um, so then the next year when Sandy came, we had already been pretty bamboozled by Irene, where we were, uh, in Long Beach, and so, um, we, we were the ones who were putting everything on the third floor of our house, when everyone else was like, Did you guys want to come over for a fucking hurricane party?

[02:13:34] Justin: And I was like, do you want to help me bring my generator up to the third floor? And they're like, not really. And I was like, well, that's the only safe place I can think of. And, and Irene, we lost all my tools. I'm not going to lose all my tools again. Everything is going to go up into the protected room on the third floor.

[02:13:51] Justin: Or I'm going to take it off the island. And so I got neighbors to help me bring the generator up. And [02:14:00] then we took, uh, twelve and a half feet of water. So, the, like, the basement, then the sub level, and Two feet of water in the first floor. All good. All my tools, everything else was up on the sub stair. And like, now everyone's wasted.

[02:14:19] Justin: We get back in town and they're like, Is your generator okay? And I was like, Of course it is. Can I, can I borrow it? And I was like, Of course you can. And I was like, you see like, every, um, you know, so we're staying at my folks house after Sandy. Um, and I would go every day. I'd work on the house, um, and then when I'd leave at night, I'd roll the generator down the block for one of my neighbors to use who was staying there with their kids.

[02:14:44] Justin: And in the morning, he'd get the kids off, roll the generator down for me to start working on the house. Yeah. Um, but that's, you know, disasters are disasters. It's I think how you recover from it. [02:15:00] And, you know, it's, it always will change things and changes your mindset, your outlook, and certainly makes you a little more, like, gun shy, I guess, like, you know, oh, we might get hit?

[02:15:17] Justin: All right, I'm, I'm gonna be the one who's freaking out a little more than everyone else if there's like a maybe.

[02:15:23] Tyler: Do you, do you feel like you don't get as attached to material things anymore after that? Like, I always feel like if you keep losing things, like you just like, I don't know.

[02:15:35] Tyler: Do you feel like it's tough to kind of feel even like at home anymore, places? Cause of that?

[02:15:43] Justin: No, but I find, I think that there's times where you think you still have something. Yeah.

[02:15:49] Tyler: Yeah.

[02:15:50] Justin: man, been looking for this for, like, three days, and I know Alright, it's not here.

[02:15:56] Justin: It's not in this box. It's gotta be with this other shit over here. [02:16:00] And then it dawns on you, I haven't had that for like 14 Like, Don't

[02:16:05] Justin: you remember when you lost, and then you're like, Now it brings you back to when you remember seeing that you lost and you're like, Oh, shit, yeah, that's,

[02:16:13] Tyler: Now it

[02:16:15] Justin: totally.

[02:16:16] Tyler: back when you remember something that you lost and you're like, Oh, yeah.

[02:16:31] Tyler: Your brother is a extremely talented chef and I'm curious like how you how that all came about and like I think it was Mata taco, which was like your first proper

[02:16:42] Justin: Yeah, so sorry After Sandy Moved out to the North Fork and I started with food trucks.

[02:16:51] Justin: So two vintage Airstreams And we're doing a ton of catering, uh, and

[02:16:59] Tyler: Is [02:17:00] it you and your brother or

[02:17:01] Justin: and my brother were partners for the first year. And then, it was tough.

[02:17:06] Tyler: with families tough.

[02:17:08] Justin: Um, and we're better, better as brothers than business partners. Um, and then, I

[02:17:16] Justin: Definitely

[02:17:18] Justin: developed a reputation for tacos on the truck.

[02:17:21] Justin: And like, Uh, I'd always be like, the best, someone would be like, this is like a California taco. And for me, I'm like, yeah, that's my, that's what I want. You know, or, or someone, someone

[02:17:35] Justin: from Mexico comes in and says like, alright, these are good tacos. You know, they're not Mexican tacos. Well, no shit, I'm not Mexican.

[02:17:44] Tyler: I know

[02:17:44] Justin: doing the best I can with what I got. But they, you know, and these are great tacos. Um. And that, to me, if a thing is worth doing, it's worth doing well. Um, and to, I think, [02:18:00]with surfing or with anything else, if you're going to do something, you want to do it to the best of your ability. Um, and push yourself.

[02:18:11] Justin: Uh, and to Matta Taco, we had a great run in Matta Taco, obviously, for five

[02:18:17] Tyler: By the way, I got to sample those tacos, they were, they were fucking good tacos and you weren't even there.

[02:18:23] Tyler: I was really bummed. I was like, I was like, dude, I'm here. Where are you? And you're like, Oh, I'm in catering. I was like, Oh, this fucking taco is so good. And the atmosphere was awesome. It was a great space. It was awesome.

[02:18:37] Justin: I was really, yeah, super proud of what we had built, um, the following we had created. Um, I miss the ocean, being on the North Fork for almost 10 years. Um, and the bulk of my catering with the trucks was on the South Fork.

[02:18:57] Justin: So there's a lot of trying to be two [02:19:00] places at one time, and the catering always requires. Me to be there, uh, to babysit and oversee everything. same with the shop. It's like, wow, I'm really, I'm not, I'm really needing to be two places at one time. Um, and putting so many miles on the back and forth.

[02:19:23] Justin: Last year I put like 52, 000 miles on three vehicles in, in one season. So it was in, in a five month period. you know, that's like nine cross country

[02:19:35] Tyler: trips.

[02:19:35] Tyler: If I can send someone, and you've got to send someone, or if you renew the lease or not, it's

[02:19:46] Justin: God forbid, you forgot something at the restaurant, and you're like, I gotta send someone, or I gotta double back, and, um, and it just was, it was a lot, um, and weren't able To renew the [02:20:00] lease in Matatuck and had the space come available on the south fork, uh, where we could continue to run the catering and just jumped So now, um, and that was the, I think the other thing was, I was surfing one winter day, um, with Dalton, and we were gonna drive back home to Orient after surfing, and he was like, what the are you doing to

[02:20:30] Justin: yourself?

[02:20:31] Justin: And I was like, what? And he was like, why? Why don't you move here? I was like, I, I don't know.

[02:20:40] Justin: You know, normally, like, I like to think I have an answer for everything. And I like, I, I couldn't, I couldn't think of a real good answer. Like, yeah, and I was like, I, I miss, I miss the beach. Um, and I lucky we're, we're in super high ground where we are in Montauk. So [02:21:00] I'm not really worried if a hurricane comes, I think,

[02:21:04] Tyler: hurricane comes.

[02:21:05] Tyler: I

[02:21:05] Justin: everywhere.

[02:21:06] Justin: Yeah, totally. Um, but I, I think what, you know, the concern in Montauk obviously with the hurricane is it will be, will be cut off. Um,

[02:21:15] Tyler: same with

[02:21:16] Justin: yeah, you become an same with Orient. Um, if and when a good one comes, like in 38 and with Donna, um, they become like islands to themselves. Um, uh, I think it was Donna, they said my, my neighbor in Orient, he, he went through Donna in, in Orient at the house he was at.

[02:21:45] Justin: He said oyster pond didn't dry out for five months after. And Oyster Pond sits in the heart of Orient Village. So you're like, dude, that means Orient is underwater? And it, and the isthmus was cut. So he's like, we were, boat [02:22:00] would go, and there was a boat taking you across Truman's Beach because the road was just blown out.

[02:22:06] Justin: And that's what happened in Montauk too, because it would just blow out, kind of where, uh, yeah, where Cyril, where Cyril's is. Is that, that's like the narrowest, lowest point. Um, and you're right, you know. You Napeak Bay on the one side and the ocean on the other.

[02:22:23] Tyler: bay on the one side and the ocean on the other. I, I miss a surf community. Um, just

[02:22:41] Justin: I love it. Yeah. I love it. I just,

[02:22:45] Justin: yeah, I missed

[02:22:47] Justin: being part of a surf community. Yeah. Um, and just having that camaraderie. Um, you know, a great group of friends on the [02:23:00] North Fork, um, but not the Stoke and the Froth and the, there's certain, totally, you know, like, eh.

[02:23:11] Justin: Oh, so and so is doing something. I don't want to drive from Orient to Montauk to come hang out and then have to drive all the way back. Now I'm like, Oh, all right, we'll go bike down for a minute. I'm not like a big social, you know, like would go out all the time, but Oh, this is a, you know, a nice to have the event in our backyard.

[02:23:32] Justin: And if it's interesting, we can go be a part of it and be a part of the community. Um, and. Yeah, I'd certainly missed it. Like, and I, I forgot, you know, how much I missed it. And like the surf community in Long Beach is amazing. Um, and it's. through thick and thin. Um, and, and community, in general, they just [02:24:00] support one another, but when you have that bond, some bond like surfing or something, it makes the connection so much greater, uh, for the community as a whole.

[02:24:10] Justin: You know, like rock climbers or snowboarders. We don't have much snow and we don't have much rock, so. We don't have much waves either, so here we get to talk about it. Um, yeah, I like, I really like the community. Um, it is a different vibe than Long Beach. Um,

[02:24:32] Justin: but it's amazing. And it's, also, having grown up competing with a lot of guys from all over Long Island.

[02:24:41] Justin: It's, um, it's like a reconnection with like a ton of old friends that I haven't seen in decades since we were, some since I was like 18 or 19. I

[02:24:51] Tyler: were, some since I was like 18 or 19. They all move, ended up in Montauk a lot of them. I feel like Montauk is [02:25:00] like the place you go to retire if you, if you do very well, obviously business wise or whatever, but it's like, that's the place that so many surfers kind of from all over Long Island end up like kind of moving

[02:25:11] Justin: Yeah. Absolutely. I think. Or they're second or third generation surfers. And so, you know, they're Parents or their grandparents bought in the 50s and 60s when it was, when Montauk was kind of frowned upon.

[02:25:29] Justin: It was, it was too far, it was too remote, it was too much of just a fishing village, uh, with not Much else on offer.

[02:25:38] Tyler: just a fishing

[02:25:41] Justin: problem. Totally. Exactly.

[02:25:42] Tyler: not

[02:25:43] Justin: bumper sticker on my truck in Ecuador.

[02:25:46] Tyler: It's

[02:25:48] Justin: So, I, It's a wonderful community of generations and generations.

[02:25:56] Justin: Multiple generations of surfers. I think even maybe more, [02:26:00] a lot than in Long Beach. Um, you know, where it's like four, you have four generations or some even close to five now, um, of, of surfing in their family. Uh, and it, it's great, you know, just to reconnect with these guys who, you know, I'll give you a perfect example.

[02:26:21] Justin: Um, living in Hawaii, I'm driving down, when I had the yellow pickup truck and, um, I'm driving down Cam Highway, kind of by Rocky Point, and I see Jabba Belly on the side of the road. And I'm like, holy shit, that's Java! I pull over and he's with his chick, uh, whatever. And I'm like, oh dude, just jump in the back of the truck.

[02:26:43] Justin: I'll take you wherever you're going. Whatever, drive them where they're going? I didn't see him again until this

[02:26:49] Tyler: Wow. Well, to be honest, I haven't seen him

[02:26:52] Justin: him Holy shit, Java! I was like, do you remember the last time I saw you? And he's like, yeah, the back of the pickup truck. And I was like, dude, that's, [02:27:00] yes, it's 24 years since the last time I saw him.

[02:27:02] Justin: It's, you know, and it's an awesome reconnection. Um, and certainly, um, a testament to the community of Long Island surfers. Not just out east, but the island as a whole, how tight knit it is.

[02:27:19] Tyler: Seriously, especially like I think our generation, we, um, we're very lucky in the sense that, uh, you know, the surf community was smaller when we grew up and you had those ESA contests that everyone went to.

[02:27:35] Tyler: And so you got to meet everyone. And then it was like, I would go spend, I would spend like a weekend with the Baileys and stay at their place, sleep on their floor, and then, or sleep in my truck, and then go surf, you know, Gary's and, you know, the Inlet there and all that, and then you'd go to Montauk and you'd Go see Charlie Wymer and the crew out there.

[02:27:54] Tyler: And like, you had like your, your, your crew, you had people you met and you can [02:28:00] connect with them and then get into that local crew in each area and you were accepted because well, one you could surf and you were kind of approved of by those other

[02:28:09] Justin: other people. And they had to, at the same time that you would go to Southampton and Montauk and stay with them.

[02:28:15] Tyler: They would come to

[02:28:16] Justin: Exactly. You know, like you had to do the contesting. That Gilgo had to do the contest in Long Beach, then all right, come stay with us now, you know, we'll, and it's, it's a small, it was, it was a small enough community that you, like, you knew pretty much everyone who was,

[02:28:34] Tyler: who

[02:28:35] Justin: who was core, who was core, yep, and it's, it's, it's funny, right?

[02:28:42] Justin: I think, not funny, but matter of fact, New York surfers are incredibly well traveled. Uh, or the core surfers, and it's, and it's been that forever. And so, it's always [02:29:00] funny, or, I don't know, not like ha ha funny, but like dang, when you're traveling. And you're in the middle of nowhere, and you stumble into someone, like, from New York that you've known forever, and you're like, Fuck, what are you doing here, dude?

[02:29:15] Tyler: to get

[02:29:16] Justin: Uh, I came here to get away from everyone. And he's like, I did the same thing. How long have you been here? How long have you been here? Uh, I don't wanna say. Okay, well, I've been coming here. Well, I've been coming here. Oh, shit, man. You mean we both have been coming here that long and haven't seen each other this whole time?

[02:29:35] Justin: So I, I, um, that is, I think it, it's an incredible thing. Um, especially for how small the surf community is that we're always on the go. And it's also cause how awful the surf can be here. Yeah. It's a lot. I think New York surfers have, [02:30:00] have discovered a number of phenomenal surf destinations. Some for the good and some for the

[02:30:10] Tyler: Not so good and and we've had we've made our mark a

[02:30:14] Justin: Yeah, absolutely.

[02:30:16] Tyler: and you know everyone from like you said like Don Iken to You know, Ricky Raz to Baal, Tom McGuinness like so many good surfers Shane, you know, Jeff Shanison

[02:30:28] Justin: many guys. Um, what's it? Uh, Brendan, uh, Brendan, Brendan McGill.

[02:30:34] Tyler: yeah. Yeah, exactly. You know did

[02:30:37] Justin: And it's funny, like, and by no means am I discounting Paul, but it's always one of those things when

[02:30:47] Justin: Uh,

[02:30:48] Justin: they say he's the first guy from New York to charge pipe and it's like, dude, not, not for nothing.

[02:30:56] Justin: I mean, he's far and away the best, [02:31:00] the best. Um, and I would say not only of New York, but in the, in the world. But as far as there's a long lineage of pipe chargers from, from Long Island. Yeah. And.

[02:31:17] Justin: it's it's a,

[02:31:21] Justin: it's a somewhat easy transition from a heaving beach break that predominantly is a left to a heaving reef break that is predominantly a left.

[02:31:33] Justin: Um, and.

[02:31:35] Tyler: And if you're used to putting on the rubber and having to get up fast while wearing all that rubber, Yeah. You get to Hawaii, it's like,

[02:31:42] Justin: And you're always, and the other thing with. With beach breaks in general, it's, the wave's never going to break at the same spot, like consistently. You're chasing the swell, whereas on a reef, a swell direction, the [02:32:00] waves are always going to be the same in that given swell direction.

[02:32:05] Justin: Um, and it makes the learning curve, um, at a spot a little easier. Um, because it's always, it's so much more consistently in one spot. Um, but yeah, the The amount of excellent to pro surfers that have come from New York is, is pretty astounding given we're New York.

[02:32:30] Tyler: Yeah.

[02:32:32] Justin: yeah

[02:32:32] Justin: and I think people forget that a lot.

[02:32:35] Tyler: a lot.

[02:32:36] Tyler: So, I

[02:32:37] Tyler: have to mention, I, I would, I think a few people would give me shit if I don't bring this up. Your surf etiquette sometimes has been a little questionable in the past.

[02:32:49] Justin: laughter And I think that just goes along with. The paddling and everything else and it's like man, you're not catching [02:33:00] waves. I I'm fucking losing my shot. I'm gonna lose my shit and it's like I I've definitely I've mellowed out as I've gotten older And I

[02:33:11] Justin: I

[02:33:11] Justin: also I think, well two things, I was never really an asshole to

[02:33:19] Tyler: with.

[02:33:21] Justin: always remember

[02:33:22] Tyler: Just my friends

[02:33:23] Justin: Just my friends and people who could surf. Who knew, like, dude, you fucked up, you know you fucked up, I know you fucked up. Let's just, let's say you fucked up and go past it. Um, but a beginner, you never want to have that. Have that kind of, um, you don't want, yeah, you don't want to do that.

[02:33:45] Justin: And, and that you're going to tarnish the experience for, for not just one session, but for a good long time. Um, but, oh my God, especially between the paddle boarding, riding. [02:34:00] What were always bigger boards because everyone wanted to be on the chips. So I would

[02:34:05] Tyler: you were always riding the alternative stuff before it was cool, you

[02:34:09] Justin: it was what I always, you know, always did.

[02:34:11] Justin: And I think. And that goes back to, we were allowed to be our own surfers.

[02:34:21] Justin: very much media or

[02:34:26] Justin: what, like, there was no specific what a surfer was and it was hard to get access to the stuff that would show you, Oh, like this, this is billabong and whatever. Um, uh, so it allowed. You to form, you know, sort of your own identity if that was what you wanted to do. So, you know, I was like, man, my first surfboard is what's the cheapest board I can get.

[02:34:58] Justin: You know, well, my first surfboard [02:35:00] was the Bushman, uh, which is too chippy, but then it was. Always the old longboards, single fins, kneeboards, fishes. Fucking get them at a garage sale for like 20 a piece. Ride them till they destroyed them. Till like, they were completely waterlogged. Who gives a fuck?

[02:35:22] Tyler: Get

[02:35:23] Justin: another one.

[02:35:24] Justin: I remember my dad coming home one day. And he's like, you're not going to And he's got like six single fins in the back of his van. And I'm like, what? Like all, all different single fins, all, all good quality, like casters, sunsets, yeah. Ain't a guy's garbage. And yeah, just up the block from us in Malvern, he's like, yeah, he's like, and the guy stops, he's like, what the fuck are you doing?

[02:35:52] Justin: And my dad's like, you don't mind if I take them, right? He's like, they're garbage, do whatever you want. He's like, what the hell do you want with them? And he's like, my son is, dude, my [02:36:00] son will ride these. And he's like, what? He's like, hold on, I got like two more, I'll go grab them. Yeah, but dad's like, go talk to the guy.

[02:36:07] Justin: He's like an old school surfer, he's like, yeah, no, no. No reason to keep these things like I have to put them out of like ten garage sales No one ever wanted them. So yeah, just figured I'll throw them away. And so I didn't um, I know There was nothing to say you couldn't march to the beat of your own drummer

[02:36:30] Tyler: Yeah

[02:36:33] Justin: And then I think when I hit like 20 or 21 and you could see Guys starting to get pissed off at me for doing it I had gotten, I had gotten better at surfing, being away at school, and now I just wasn't the guy running shitty boards, but I was the guy running shitty boards now getting, getting waves.

[02:36:58] Justin: Um, and that kind [02:37:00] of,

[02:37:02] Justin: um, it pissed people off, and then, so that, that pissed people off. And then they're like, and he's an asshole in the water.

[02:37:13] Tyler: on the left. Not only is

[02:37:16] Justin: Not only is he riding these fucking boards, but he's also a dick. And I'm like, well, alright, yeah. I can't, I can't argue with either of those statements.

[02:37:26] Tyler: statements.

[02:37:27] Justin: I

[02:37:27] Justin: just, and it was, it, I think In hindsight, I, like, I may have ruffled some feathers, but I think most people looking back are like, it was kind of all in good fun, and you just never took it too serious.

[02:37:45] Justin: And I'd be like, you know, I fucking eat pieces of shit like you for breakfast, and I'd be like, you eat pieces of shit?

[02:37:52] Tyler: for breakfast?

[02:37:52] Tyler: And I'm

[02:37:54] Justin: I'm like, dude, really? That's a, we could go back and forth about this? Uh, yeah. I [02:38:00] think the other thing, I, I, and I would rarely say it, but if it just, like, if someone like, kept at it with, Oh, you're on the fucking longboard, and this and that,

[02:38:10] Tyler: gonna fucking burn a

[02:38:11] Justin: Dude, I'll, no, no, I would say, I'll, Do this.

[02:38:15] Justin: I'll trade you. still, I'll still outsurf you, but you can ride my longboard, be fear for your fucking death, because it's 10 foot, 50 pounds, doesn't have a leash, and I'll ride your thruster. I'll still have a ton of fun on your thruster, and you're just sulk and go, I fucking hate this guy even more now.

[02:38:36] Justin: So I think You, I, I definitely became, not just alternative, but I want to write everything. Um, and with writing it, with taking into account like the historical, um, value of what I was writing and maybe [02:39:00] thinking, you know, if it's this kind of board, this is how it should be written. Like take a whole board, for example, they're so fucking hard to surf.

[02:39:10] Justin: They're so hard to serve and it,

[02:39:12] Tyler: It's very hard to

[02:39:13] Justin: and it

[02:39:14] Tyler: You need a wave, a specific wave

[02:39:16] Justin: and it takes, and it's like all these very little body

[02:39:21] Tyler: And

[02:39:21] Justin: and you'd watch, you know, there was a while they were so

[02:39:24] Tyler: I know.

[02:39:25] Justin: and I go, Oh my God, I don't really have the right wave for it. And you are trying to surf it like you're on a fuckin fun shape.

[02:39:34] Justin: What the

[02:39:37] Justin: How about you just hand me 1, 100 and I'll slap you in the head? And like, give you that eye opening experience you've wanted. You just like, that's not That's not how you do it, and, and shame on you, for, you know, wasting the money, wasting the shaper's time, you know, this is a guy's craft that he's honed, worked on this specific [02:40:00] design, and you're just, you're fucking murdering it, and not in a good way, you know, and, and, So I, I, if I'm going to write a whole, I want to write, you know, I want to ride the boards how they're meant to be written.

[02:40:15] Justin: Um, and I think that that, that's really important. style, style matters. Um, and riding the right equipment on the right, on the right wave. And I think that was what really made, got people so pissed off is I catch a ton of waves.

[02:40:39] Justin: Be getting Oh, getting so many barrels off the jetties. Yeah. And people are pissed off that they're not on a six nine and that they're on a, you know, they're 5, 5

[02:40:50] Justin: 19 and a, quarter, you can't fucking paddle

[02:40:53] Tyler: 5'5 Exactly,

[02:40:55] Tyler: in

[02:40:55] Justin: Or any in, in a wave of consequence or just a wave a size. And you know, it's [02:41:00] like, wait a second. Especially coming from Hawaii. You already knew, alright, if there's a big wave, you need a big board. Plain and simple. And then the wave seems more accessible. Instead of being scared out of your mind because you're in that undergund.

[02:41:17] Justin: And knowing that you're constantly gonna be scratching. Either for the outside or to get in. I, I don't, I don't enjoy that. Um, I wanna, I wanna get waves. I'm, surfing.

[02:41:31] Justin: The 99 percent of the paddling, I still got to do, but I want to maximize that 1%, um, with the right, with the right board choice. Um, and it's, well, I have a ridiculous quiver of boards too, um, which I'm trying to whittle down.

[02:41:47] Justin: It's so hard. It is, but you know, as, like I said, I think one of the things is as I've hit, About to hit 50. I don't really see that I'm going to ride my 5. 1 Dick Van [02:42:00] Strallen fish much more. Um, even in Ecuador. I, I want the 5. 3 or the 5. 5. And so I look at it and I'm like, but I'm not, I just don't see myself going back to it.

[02:42:15] Tyler: see myself going back to it. And now I'm gonna shoehorn

[02:42:21] Justin: I'm not, I'm not going to shoehorn myself back into

[02:42:24] Tyler: stupid in them when

[02:42:26] Justin: looked stupid in them when I could fit in them. Exactly. So, and I, and Joel, and I, last, it was the last year or two years ago, I remember Joel Tudor saying, like, he won't ride a horse. A board under seven feet long, uh, less, he doesn't have to paddle for the wave. So like, and I, and I, I kind of was like, Oh, you always have to power for the wave. And I was like, I get it if it's, if it's like a barreling wave, 10 feet off the beach, all right, you know what, I'll, I'll go on a chippier [02:43:00]board.

[02:43:01] Justin: And I, but I don't, I hate feeling lost at sea on the wrong equipment. Um, and so that, that kind of is that dive into alternative equipment. Um, and I just like. I love the history, the history of surfing. That was the other thing,

[02:43:17] Justin: so.

[02:43:18] Tyler: history of surfing. What is the history of surfing? Well, I

[02:43:34] Justin: well, I think basketball, you know, you have different changes of style. Um, so you can, but you're so your approach changes. Um, and that's the same as surfing over history.

[02:43:48] Justin: Our approach of the waves has changed, but our equipment's changed. The basketball is still the same. Um, but I, I wish I'm glad to see it now that [02:44:00] more people are on the scene. More alternative or equipment that better suits their surfing. I'm so happy to see some of the guys that I grew up with in Long Beach on like 6'8

[02:44:12] Tyler: I know.

[02:44:14] Justin: Kind of eggish y, a little more full, let's just call them a little more full bodied equipment.

[02:44:19] Tyler: little

[02:44:20] Justin: Because it's just, you can see that they're now having more fun. Kind of like the fun they'd see me having and be like, he's a dick.

[02:44:28] Tyler: they'd see me having, and be like, he's a dick.

[02:44:33] Justin: boy. Um,

[02:44:34] Tyler: what,

[02:44:35] Justin: you know what? I, I would say chippy, but even he did, he's got more volume. Yeah. Um.

[02:44:42] Tyler: But he won't be ridin a, he won't be ridin a longboard or a mid length any time

[02:44:47] Justin: Not a snowball's chance in hell.

[02:44:49] Tyler: chance now.

[02:44:50] Tyler: I

[02:44:50] Justin: more power, I mean, fuck, he's such a, that,

[02:44:53] Tyler: Good, good surfer.

[02:44:54] Justin: best backside barrel rider. Nassau County. Yeah, just [02:45:00] phenomenal. Like I, I remember one swell and we're taking turns on the jetty and it was like four of like Mike.

[02:45:18] Justin: Maybe Chris

[02:45:20] Justin: Martin,

[02:45:23] Justin: and either Richie, or TJ, but it's just the four of us. And it's like, we're all in rotation, and it's just, we're all getting

[02:45:32] Tyler: rotation.

[02:45:33] Justin: And Mike

[02:45:36] Justin: is underneath me,

[02:45:38] Tyler: I'm I'm up. Selena goes

[02:45:42] Justin: And Salerno goes,

[02:45:46] Justin: what? I

[02:45:47] Justin: go, don't go. And I just looked at him and I was like, he's gonna fucking kill me if I go. And I just, I pulled back and he got so cagged, made it out. And I was like, sad, yeah, you know, sometimes

[02:45:58] Tyler: You know,

[02:45:59] Justin: [02:46:00] you gotta.

[02:46:03] Tyler: Whoever is being the biggest, go out way to give them

[02:46:13] Justin: The biggest asshole in the lineup. Whoever's being the biggest jerk and burning everyone, I'll, I'll usually go out of my way to give them one back. And, you know, I don't mind getting a little tussle over it. But, I, um, Now it's all about having fun. Um,

[02:46:36] Tyler: My favorite is Matcher. I love to burn. Matcher. Yeah,

[02:46:39] Justin: Hey, hey,

[02:46:40] Tyler: Well, I mean, because I know he is not gonna get pissed too much, but

[02:46:44] Justin: Yeah, I mean, it's fun to burn your friends. Yes. Yeah, totally. And, you know, do you always, and there's like rules to it too. Of course.

[02:46:53] Justin: Do you do driver's privilege?

[02:46:56] Justin: So like, alright, let's say we go to Jersey, [02:47:00] I drive. If I drive, dude, if the set comes and I want to go, dude, I drove, this is driver's privilege, you gotta pull back.

[02:47:07] Tyler: Oh. People, people who get, who uh, store boards at my place or anything like that, there's a tax. There's a

[02:47:14] Justin: totally, it's a waive tax, exactly. You had to see that one coming.

[02:47:17] Tyler: see that one coming.

[02:47:19] Tyler: What um, what are you riding now? What's the board that's your go to at the moment that you're just in love with?

[02:47:26] Justin: love with? Um, the, uh,

[02:47:32] Justin: Mid Length for Black Belt by Christian

[02:47:34] Tyler: Mmm, I love his shapes. They're fuckin beautiful. You were actually coming in to pick up one of those boards, I think.

[02:47:41] Justin: think,

[02:47:42] Tyler: When we last met. Uh,

[02:47:43] Justin: Uh, yes, that's right. So, I have, I have two. I have a 9 1 and a 7 5. Yeah. So 9 1 is

[02:47:54] Justin: when it's small and awesome when it's huge. Um, but that [02:48:00] it was a little limiting in the mid mid size.

[02:48:04] Justin: So the seven five is to fill that hole.

[02:48:10] Justin: Yeah. six

[02:48:11] Justin: channel, six channel, single fin, wide point, way forward. Um, and it, the

[02:48:19] Justin: nine one, you can take off cheater five on it and step back and, you know, pull in, do big sweeping turns. That's crazy. I'm only riding like a seven inch parish fin on it. So it's real wide base fin.

[02:48:34] Justin: And then the seven five, like I said, it's just for that. More hollow days, like more Long Beach day versus Montauk for the 9 1. Uh, so I can, easier to duck dive, um, and then I have, um, two longboards coming from Gene. Yeah, two cooper fishes coming.

[02:48:54] Tyler: So

[02:48:55] Justin: super

[02:48:55] Justin: stoked on that. Um, he just is [02:49:00] getting back into getting boards going again.

[02:49:02] Justin: And I was like, so stoked that I could get in on it. Um, he's just a man. So, yeah, I think, what other boards? Um, I didn't just, I got a hold of a bunch of uh, Scott Anderson's

[02:49:17] Tyler: Oof. They're hard to get nowadays.

[02:49:20] Justin: I, I, I was really lucky, someone out in Montauk, um, kind of parted with a quiver. And, like, uh, he did two boards, and then sold off one more, and I just, I kept grabbing him.

[02:49:34] Justin: And he definitely, um,

[02:49:38] Justin: as far as California

[02:49:39] Justin: Shapers go, everyone seemed to follow, like, you're a Takayama guy, you're a Skip Fry guy, you know. Yeah, but you definitely, um, uh, Anderson boards were something really different. And, um, where they were based out of, and he just didn't. Well, it didn't follow, [02:50:00] and Stein stuck with what, uh, he felt, uh, was tried and true.

[02:50:06] Justin: But that being said, I have, one of the boards from him that I, like, love the most is a K Board.

[02:50:13] Justin: So

[02:50:14] Justin: it's like a copy of Skip's K.

[02:50:16] Tyler: So it's

[02:50:17] Justin: So it's a, it's like an egged out, knife y railed thruster. Um, and it's It's insane. It's insane. So, if you ever stumble across an Anderson for sale, jump on it. Jump on it. Anderson and Bruce Jones.

[02:50:32] Tyler: Jones.

[02:50:32] Justin: Yup. It's sick. Yup. And your go to? What are

[02:50:38] Justin: you

[02:50:38] Tyler: do you surf? I mean, this is bad, but I got like a, I got one of the, I got a mid length, a 7'6 um, it's a, uh, it's a pop out, it's a GSI board, uh, but I love it, it rides insane, it's fucking great, and like, been riding that, I got a, a Chopwood, uh, board, which is, [02:51:00] um, This guy, Paul Colbert and Paul shaped me, we did a, we took a Steve Liz template for the front quarter or front half then about for like a small sliver of it, we use an Andrini down the mid and then a skip fry pin tail, uh, on it on the tail.

[02:51:19] Justin: K Board

[02:51:20] Tyler: it's a Lizdrini fry, we call it and it's quad really good and solid surf. Uh, smaller, mushier waves, probably not, I go to the mid length, and then I have also a, um, a 6'8 longfish that I shaped with, um, Jimmy O'Brien from Poem Surf in, uh, Rockaway. We took the template of my Josh Hall longfish, which was a skip fry, basically, replica.

[02:51:46] Tyler: And we, we took the template and just basically reshaped it, but made it a little softer rails, a little bit more forgiving and made it a quad instead of a twin keel. And that's actually, I use that with those S wing fins [02:52:00] and it's like my go to

[02:52:02] Justin: as a quad As

[02:52:03] Tyler: I twin, I ride it as a twin with the S wing fins because those things are so long. that it's so insane and

[02:52:11] Justin: I wanted to get a pair of those. I think I had amused and I just missed it

[02:52:16] Tyler: Gre uh, Reese,

[02:52:17] Tyler: Reese, Lewis online, he sent me a pair for free. He's like, we were writing, I'm like, yo, how'd they go? And he's like, what do you like? You know, are you future or FCS? I'm like, future. He's like, I'll send you a pair. I'm like, No way. And got on it and it's like, I've used it on other boards and it doesn't work as well, but for this board, particularly like a straighter outline, less roundness, it worked great.

[02:52:40] Justin: like current swears by those.

[02:52:42] Tyler: They're sick. They're so fun. They're so fun and loose and, but drivey and fast and twangy. And, you know, you can lean like when you connect that bottom turn and you hit the lip, you feel this twang

[02:52:56] Justin: off. Oh, I'm sure. You gotta get so much flex out of those fins.

[02:52:59] Tyler: [02:53:00] It's sick. So that's been kind of like my go to right now. I have a, I have a long board.

[02:53:05] Tyler: I have a, I just have a torque because I didn't want to, I'm taking it up and down stairs. I don't want to fucking have a nice board to damage, but I'm going to shape, uh, I've got a 11 foot EPS blank that I'm going to grab. And Paul and I are going to do a glider and, but we're going to put some wings in it and make it like a little bit more user friendly than like those skip fry gliders.

[02:53:28] Justin: Like, um, the ones that Charles is

[02:53:31] Tyler: Yeah.

[02:53:31] Tyler: yeah, I love his gliders.

[02:53:33] Justin: He's got some really nice

[02:53:34] Tyler: Oh, I love his boards. So, yeah, that's what, and like, I've been going out to surf the middle of the inlet, uh, between Atlantic Beach and Rockway, that outer bar on the glider, and it's like The best feeling ever.

[02:53:50] Tyler: like,

[02:53:50] Justin: well, I'm so glad you mentioned that spot and not me.

[02:53:53] Tyler: please. If you want to, if it's, it's mad fickle. It's like half a mile out to sea. It's [02:54:00] sketchy as fuck. . And,

[02:54:02] Justin: It's just fickle.

[02:54:03] Justin: It's, It's,

[02:54:04] Justin: fickle and it's hard to get to and it's hard to see when it's working.

[02:54:07] Tyler: and it's only really good on a foil, to be honest.

[02:54:11] Justin: be honest, .

[02:54:12] Tyler: And, and you need, uh, you need a lot of money for that. Yeah.

[02:54:15] Justin: I'm not, you know, I, I, I haven't gotten into it and it's a big, uh,

[02:54:23] Justin: big

[02:54:23] Justin: foil community in, in Montauk.

[02:54:27] Justin: I kind of, I was thinking about it yesterday, going back to being a waterman and more time in the water, and I'm like, fuck, these guys, you know, like cold and windy, it's flat, they never got the kite or the wing, and they're on the water, and there's something to be said about that, so, you know, it does, it does, it looks expensive, and dangerous, and all that.

[02:54:53] Justin: some

[02:54:53] Justin: of the foils in the water are just,

[02:54:58] Justin: it's just sketchy. [02:55:00] Sketchy and, you know, a danger.

[02:55:04] Justin: But everyone else in the water, I already add to that doing what I do. I don't need to put a foil on

[02:55:11] Tyler: know! Well, if I'm doing it, it's like, away from everybody.

[02:55:15] Justin: And I, I actually tried, um, an e foil,

[02:55:21] Tyler: Ooh, yeah,

[02:55:22] Justin: um, just as a guy had, it was like, dude, you could, you do everything. It was so hard.

[02:55:27] Justin: It was hard.

[02:55:27] Tyler: It's counter what you normally, your body. Yeah. Mechanics

[02:55:30] Justin: totally so difficult, but it just, you know,

[02:55:35] Justin: it's another thing to keep yourself occupied. Um,

[02:55:39] Tyler: keep you in the water.

[02:55:40] Justin: yeah, and that's, that's really what it comes down to. As many things as you can do to keep yourself in the water. And. Keep your mind off the other bullshit. That's

[02:55:51] Tyler: That we're living

[02:55:52] Justin: Yeah, you know, it's

[02:55:55] Justin: Like that surfer the surfers movie when Mickey door is like dude.

[02:55:59] Justin: I [02:56:00] take off I drop in Crying mothers the bitching the teachers the FBI all that shit just goes off the back. I don't fucking care about that It's just me on that wave and that's it. Just all off the

[02:56:14] Tyler: Don't forget that. He's gotta do the, the tongue clock when he does that. He's like, it's just me. Well, Justin, uh, where can our listeners find you? This is, first, thank you for coming in twice and spending all this time and going through all these awesome stories.

[02:56:35] Justin: fun. It was a lot of fun. I'm not promoting anything. Well,

[02:56:38] Tyler: Well, where can, if they want to hire you to cater or something, you know, uh,

[02:56:41] Justin: go, go on matataco.

[02:56:43] Justin: com and you can reach out to us. for your next party.

[02:56:47] Tyler: And your Instagram food truck on the

[02:56:49] Justin: yep. We cover from Manhattan to the Forks, mainly the Forks. Um, but we do a lot of holiday parties in the city over the winter.

[02:56:57] Tyler: Best

[02:56:57] Justin: Yeah. Yeah. [02:57:00] Um, but yeah, you know, I look forward to seeing everyone in the water. Um, you know, I am. As I've gotten older, I think I've gotten more stoked on stoking other people out.

[02:57:12] Justin: Uh, that's certainly, um, is a change in mindset and, um, it makes for a better life. Because you, um, I just as much enjoy watching someone else excel or not, not suck. And like, make their little step,

[02:57:37] Tyler: a little bit better.

[02:57:38] Justin: you know, Hey, I saw it, you know, and that you can acknowledge that they did it. Hey, dude, I think you just cross stepped.

[02:57:45] Justin: I think I saw, or whatever it is, and like stoking that person out. Um, it gives me, makes me just as happy as my getting a good wave now. Um, and I think that's because I never went the lesson, [02:58:00] you know, as a surf instructor. So, now I can sit here. And it's, I love it. Like, I love to give people tips and advice.

[02:58:08] Justin: I just don't, because I'm not, it's not a profession. It's just like, hey, can I,

[02:58:14] Justin: can I ask

[02:58:15] Justin: you what I'm doing wrong? I would love to tell you what you're doing wrong.

[02:58:19] Justin: I, because, because it's killing, it's killing me watching it, and I know I can tell you what to do to make it better, but fuck, you never ask, so I'm never gonna do it.

[02:58:30] Justin: I'm just gonna be like, that guy never gets better. He does the same stupid thing every time. So, it's, you know, um, I, I think, uh, now I, I appreciate helping others improve, um, as much as I like surfing

[02:58:47] Justin: myself.

[02:58:48] Tyler: myself. Give a wave, you, you know, you, they might have a cute sister or something.

[02:58:56] Justin: They always have a cute

[02:58:59] Tyler: Well, [02:59:00] Justin, man, it, ah, so good to reconnect and be able to talk to you here. This is awesome. Uh, listeners. Uh, go check out matataco. com if you want to get some good tacos for an event. And, uh, if you want to follow some good surfing stuff on Instagram, it's, uh, food truck on the run, on the road, sorry. And, um, gotta give a quick shout out here to first Joe, our engineer, who's fucking the

[02:59:26] Justin: killed it.

[02:59:26] Tyler: Gotta thank Rockefeller Center for hosting us here and, uh, such a great location.

[02:59:32] Justin: got lost coming in here, . I came from the subway this time instead of on the road.

[02:59:37] Justin: Yeah. And I'm like, underneath, and I'm going,

[02:59:40] Tyler: labyrinth under

[02:59:41] Justin: I think we peed over here, and then all of a sudden I'm at the Today Show, and I'm going, oh, I'm so in the wrong spot now, and I don't know how I got here at all, and I'm like, looking around, and there's nobody around to direct me, and I'm like, uh, I know I can't walk into that door, But someone's got to direct me.

[02:59:58] Justin: There's no maps anywhere. [03:00:00] You're just, you're, it is definitely, um, it

[03:00:03] Tyler: And the next thing you know, you're sitting next to Savannah Guthrie on the today's show talking about surfing.

[03:00:09] Justin: That's how it happened. Thanks, Tyler.

[03:00:12] Tyler: Thanks, Justin. And, and thank you all listeners for listening. And obviously don't forget to check out, uh, swell season. You can follow us online, swell season, surf radio. com, or you can follow us on Instagram at swell season, surf radio. And also. Now we're on Blue Sky, another social media app, but, uh, you can follow us there too.

[03:00:33] Tyler: And, um, and New Elgrim, exactly. And, uh, listeners, we'll check you all down the line.

[03:00:39] Justin: See you in the water. You.